So you would point out things like this when other players do it right, or do you only care it's this one player

I already got examples if need be.

Like Kid said, Octane is the most visible due to him being transparent about which alt accounts are his. There are many examples of players having multiple runs (historically) without having all the games expire on their other ladder accounts.

https://www.warlight.net/LadderTeam?LadderTeamID=12721
https://www.warlight.net/LadderTeam?LadderTeamID=14814
https://www.warlight.net/LadderTeam?LadderTeamID=17566
https://www.warlight.net/LadderTeam?LadderTeamID=18218

(This is just the best example I could find currently, not as a method to start another stupid flamewar. Nauz hasn't started his other 29 runs yet, or I'd post those links.)

I also am culpable for "gaming" the system by starting a run on an alt while my games were expiring on my main. I was impatient and had started the alt run a couple of days before the last two games on my main expired. This chaining of ladder runs isn't new, and it won't be an issue until the rules pertaining to chaining runs are put into effect. If Octane or anyone else is breaking the ladder rules after they are put into effect, then I'll understand and agree with people calling rulebreakers out. Until then, I see no point in all this constant attacking.

@TBest, stalling also gives players an "unfair advantage" currently, yet I've seen nobody complain about this in the thread: https://www.warlight.net/MultiPlayer?GameID=14024002

Edited 9/27/2017 04:18:52

"You shall not operate more than one WarLight account in a way that gives you an advantage in a game, tournament or ladder."

That rule is already in place and as i cleared up in a thread recently it is not allowed to play with multiple accounts on ladders, when other accounts of yourself have unexpired games. Fizzers statement on my question was clear on that.

(It also doesn't matter if someone saw my thread or not, we all agreed on those 4 rules posted in the warlight wiki before our first game.)

People weren't punished for it yet, but those rules are there and are in place, so yes u can definitely say Octane broke the rules and could receive a warning, ban or whatever for it, as could others.

Edited 9/27/2017 04:24:25

sry, double posting???

Edited 9/27/2017 04:26:39

@AG you linked a gameID, not a thred. But people certainly complain about stalling giving an unfair advantage in past seasonal ladders.

I don’t feel like Octane has been hated on that much compered to past cases. Like the one regarding my clan. But it certainly is possible my memory is biased. I will say it again for my own amusement but the rules regarding multaconting certenty was and are i place right now. Either way give it a couple of weeks or days and we will probably have some new drama taking all the focus anyway.

Read the chat TBest.

I don’t feel like Octane has been hated on that much compered to past cases. Like the one regarding my clan. But it certainly is possible my memory is biased. I will say it again for my own amusement but the rules regarding multaconting certenty was and are i place right now. Either way give it a couple of weeks or days and we will probably have some new drama taking all the focus anyway.

His name is the only name here being dragged in the mud which is unfair. Same goes for any other players who got singled out if they hadn't been given a fair warning prior.

I think the fact that it's just a game ID and not an actual thread proves my point already.

@Edge, Fizzer has always been incredibly lax on rules. In fact, Ladder Rule #3 in the New Ladder Rules is just there to make the only "unofficial" rule on the RTL (that you can only have one ranked account on the ladder at all times) official. But with the way the rules are enforced, it has become commonplace to ignore them and get away with things that are technically against the rules. For example, players have sworn/used derogatory insults frequently in WL games, have had multiple coin accounts, have hacked other players' accounts, etc. and 99% have not been punished. Players who have even played their alts on the ladder have not been banned or even suspended. So, you could definitely say anyone who has operated multiple accounts on the 1v1 ladder with unexpired games (including myself for a period of 2 weeks) deserves to be banned, but with how lenient rule-breakers are treated it's no wonder so many continue to break the rules - knowingly or unknowingly. You cannot fault Octane alone (as people have been doing so here) for being the latest in a horde of rule-breaking cases.

@TBest, your clan has been hated on because of a select few constantly dragging your reputation down in the forums. So, realistically, you have only your clanmates to blame for that.

Edited 9/27/2017 04:47:42

First Edge makes a post, with snapshot of mail-where Fizzer says for non-RT one has to wait till the games expire.

Then Beren makes a post(the opening post) where he says, "I have been working with Fizzer and a few other people to draft a set of potential official rules for Warlight ladders. Also, there will now be a point of emphasis to enforce these rules more strongly than has happened in the past. "

In later posts in same thread, TBest and Beren says these aren't new rules, already existing one and in his post Fizzer says "Before these rules are accepted, I suggest that we should try as hard as possible to define what is considered stalling and what isn't."
So, did Fizzer say about all the rules as these rules or the rule concerning stalling alone as these rules?

With confusing word play in this thread, whose words exactly have to be taken? I am confused and might have misunderstood that Fizzer meant all these rules are to be accepted sometime later and I were to see an announcement of these rules and it is ok to do my alt runs before that particular announcement. (sorry for being bad in English,if I misunderstood that).

@TBest- Awesome guy meant this thread as this thread and the game linked as a proof for stalling a loss, which apparently gave that 2v2 ladder team 1st rank(if i am correct).

Edited 9/27/2017 04:58:09

Kid all 3 things can be right the same time. The actual rule just says you shall not operate an alt account on a ladder which gives you unfair advantage. To clear up what is considered to be an umfair advantage beren tried to make rules. The only really new aspect of the rules are stalling imo, which was unethical before, but not defined on what is stalling.

@TBest, stalling also gives players an "unfair advantage" currently, yet I've seen nobody complain about this in the thread: https://www.warlight.net/MultiPlayer?GameID=14024002

Yeah, dry-clean-only definitey stalled a turn here, and that allowed them to take the 1st place and the golden trophy from boubou and me. But really, I don't blame him here.

The 2v2 ladder was broken for a couple of days, on the 08/09 and on the 09/09. And right before it broke, dry-clean-only and carlos were right behind us, I remember that at some point on the 07/09, they were 2nd but they had the same rating we had.
Given how ratings fluctuate, it's very likely that they'd have taken the 1st place fair and square on the 08/09 or the 09/09, if the ladder had worked properly.

So in this particular situation - and only because the ladder was broken -, I can understand the stalling.

@ AG

I totally agree that in the past those actions weren't punished at all. And i know Octane, Platinum, u or myself (I once did also an alt run where i didn't waited 5 months) aren't the only ones who did that. To be honest i think the majority of (strategic) players who have an alt did break those rules under these regards at least once.

But still nobody could have protested against a punishment. We all accepted those rules and are all responsible for our actions.

Talking about myself i acknowledged these rules as all the others before my first game, but i never knew and never thought about that u need to wait 5 months until all games have been expired before u can join a ladder with an alt, since alts were and still are accepted by Warlight.

I first realized it when Fizzer gave me that answer. I was really surprised and therefore decided on making a public thread to remind everyone on the meaning of the rules in that regard.

There were a little of discussions in all chats i've been in. We discussed it in our Outlaws Skype chat and there were even bigger discussion on the Warlight (Strategy) Skype Chat. U know which one i mean. So i do think i reached my goal to spread that knowledge around the Strat community and minor and major strat clans.

Coming back to Octane and why people even brought him up here is because he excessivly switched accounts which is pretty outrageous and needs a pretty criminal mindset (is that justice wise the right expression when u break consiously rules). I think that can't be defended even by any moral standpoint. I can't remember of any player who did that in such a manner, so when it's done in such an excessive way it's pretty natural that that name will be brought up first. In my view it's not even unfair, cause there is nothing to defend such an excessive behaviour.

Now the only argument that could be brought up to defend his actions is not knowing about these rules. He is in 3 Clans, members from 2 of them discussed in the thread i made about the topic, so my guess would be that it was brought up and he recognized it. It's just a guess through, but what is sure is that those people of his clans who did know about the rules could have remind him on the rules so either the communication didn't worked or Octane indeed knew about the rules and still decided to continue in that way.

That's btw. also the big difference between Octane and Plat. The moment Plat knew about it he didn't switched his accounts again.

"@TBest, stalling also gives players an "unfair advantage" currently, yet I've seen nobody complain about this in the thread: https://www.warlight.net/MultiPlayer?GameID=14024002 "

I did.

As for AG's earlier comment, there won't be any other ladder runs.

I'm happy with 19-1 and 2200+ rating.

Edited 9/27/2017 06:51:36

I'm happy with 19-1 and 2200+ rating

What took you so long? We all were waiting on that

I will make a bigger forum post tomorrow when I have time, but just know that my pair of 3v3 ladder runs will be the final time I cheat, and that I apologize for not committing to the new rules earlier.



Octane

I don't see that you have any need to explain your reasons for doing something half the people in this thread have done.

Myself, mod, Edge, AG, Platinum, Kid, and quite likely others in this thread have all had unexpired games on the ladder on more than one account.

mod and myself have even had them ranked at the same time and have had ladder games where our accounts were matched to play against each other.

The only person I'd ever say went above and beyond and blatantly flaunted the rules and unanimously deserved punishment would be gnuffone. His RTL record holding account played vs. himself 7 times on the way to reaching its peak rating.

mod and I accidentally played vs. ourselves once each, we were not intentionally doing it to boost our rating as gnuffone has done multiple times.

Edited 9/27/2017 07:34:12

Not trying to witch hunt octane here, he just seems eager to get 1st but ended up on 1800s ;)

The alts on the ladders are lame, you can blame the system for its flaws which there are many but it still makes the ladder overall worse and should not be allowed.

Nauz and his army of alts do not make the ladder better for anyone else and neither does octane's. Especially when you have 5 pops at hitting #1 while everyone else has one every 5 months.

Coming back to Octane and why people even brought him up here is because he excessivly switched accounts which is pretty outrageous and needs a pretty criminal mindset (is that justice wise the right expression when u break consiously rules). I think that can't be defended even by any moral standpoint. I can't remember of any player who did that in such a manner, so when it's done in such an excessive way it's pretty natural that that name will be brought up first. In my view it's not even unfair, cause there is nothing to defend such an excessive behaviour.

Now the only argument that could be brought up to defend his actions is not knowing about these rules. He is in 3 Clans, members from 2 of them discussed in the thread i made about the topic, so my guess would be that it was brought up and he recognized it. It's just a guess through, but what is sure is that those people of his clans who did know about the rules could have remind him on the rules so either the communication didn't worked or Octane indeed knew about the rules and still decided to continue in that way.

Afaik, the little chat we had on Lynx discord about it (and it wasn't much), Octane didn't participate in the conversation. And being on a discord with over 200,000 messages, it shouldn't be a suprise that he might've missed that.

That's btw. also the big difference between Octane and Plat. The moment Plat knew about it he didn't switched his accounts again.

Acting like this is a huge difference is incorrect imo, especially if you do not know this is true when it comes to him knowing this rule. Plat has arguably done worse on the 3v3 Ladder as he kept creating new ladder runs with different account without finishing other runs, doing something he knows happens - tanking other players ratings because he wouldn't finish a run.

I'm not here to cast blame on plat, or anyone else for that matter. I'm just sick of players being singled out for something a ton of other people did with no repercussions.

@Buns is it lame? Sure. That's what the rules will do to fix that, but I know several people (myself included) with unexpired games on 3 accounts (same as Octane).

Still not fair to just throw the blame on one player.

If you ever fall into a grey area while playing the ladders then make sure you join 101st, they provide the best attorneys in all the warlight clans to defend your case ;)

I will defend our members if I feel they are getting treated unfairly. I would hope you would do the same for a Turtle's player.