'"You can please some of the people all of the time, all of the people some of the time. But you can't please all the people all of the time." - John Lydgate

I've been playing video games since 1977. There has never been a perfect game. Be happy with what you have.

If Fizzer feels like doing something, he will. Until then, relax and enjoy the ride.

Their cheating problem was simply so massiv that they had to get rid of that feature.

Yes, they had a massiv cheating problem, no removing prime was not about it, I just read it. There was a black market for CSGO accounts before prime, prime helped people to get accounts legit ways and increased the ratio of non-hacking players. They removed prime after they stopped hackers with a more direct approach (article doesn't go much in detail but its something similar to Valorant's anti-hacking strategy).

So again, Fizzer can safely implement this for this game without any significant risk to his game.

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When part of the solution is to get rid of an income source for Fizzer i highly doubt he will be interested.

My proposal provides free access to all maps freely to every player. Which helps players to experiment freely so that they'll not be too frustrated from the game. Plus they'll be able to get small amount of coins everyday passively which will encourage players to participate more in this game.

As we already talked, Fizzler gains almost no income from selling maps, his by far, main source of income is ad videos. On the other hand, l4v.r0v showed that 99% of all new players are simply leaving the game. They play 1 game and just stop. Coins are big deal in the game and frustration is definitely one of the main problems of new players. So if this system reduces the new player quit rate from 99% to 98%, Fizzler's income will more or less double. Hence this is surely a sensible strategy financially. Moreover, as we already talked about it, he can simply stop this system anyway.

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How many players *MORE* would now stay because they saw they got 5 coins?

It's not only about 5 coins, its *daily* 5 coins and Oh boy! If you believe people don't care about 5 daily coins, ask Fizzer how many people watches those long commercials :D He literally had to put limitation (every 16 hours) on people watching ads because there was not enough advertisement to watch

Edited 3/27/2023 15:57:42

@Roi Joleil

Other ideas might be better but i didnt bother thinking to much about them. Tho id imagine some will have their own massiv problems to them.

Why are you so focused on dismissing suggestions? I'm not complaining about your negative criticism, they are mostly on point and its helping us revize all the possible risks before implementation. But believing that other suggestions has their own massive problems without even having any objection about them is a prejudiced perspective, not a healthy way of looking at things...

"Yes, they had a massiv cheating problem, no removing prime was not about it, I just read it. There was a black market for CSGO accounts before prime, prime helped people to get accounts legit ways and increased the ratio of non-hacking players. They removed prime after they stopped hackers with a more direct approach (article doesn't go much in detail but its something similar to Valorant's anti-hacking strategy)."

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"Valve has removed the free path towards attaining the Prime Status Upgrade. This status can now only be acquired by purchasing it directly in-game or via the Steam store. [...] In a bid to improve the overall CS:GO matchmaking system and indirectly combat the incessant cheating instances plaguing the game, Valve has made it compulsory for players to obtain a Prime Status Upgrade in order to enjoy ranked matchmaking." as of June 2021 when they removed free Prime

"CS:GO went free to play over three years ago and is still going strong...Along with all the gameplay that we made available for free, new players had access to drops, Ranks, Skill Groups, and a free path to Prime matchmaking. Unfortunately, over time, those benefits have become an incentive for bad actors to hurt the experience of both new and existing players."
https://www.engadget.com/csgo-ranked-matches-no-longer-free-to-play-132009460.html?guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuZ29vZ2xlLmNvbS8&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAAAhaF2cuWsa9NRSg-SCLAURvtXbnTLXCUnyta5E0dKHhL8jYvRAbwJIfUG7BVuyVYhiAowMBS44Ck1-UGo13pKsrbhyKjZLSifrmytTbnmRYtab9PDA1EAn7ZDltq13-NjdjtcSJYqdgpsvsCjOD_7WIdt6ZcrejgwSpGj6ILSmy

https://www.dexerto.com/csgo/csgo-players-pay-ranked-prime-status-revamp-1588238/

"Once you've got a CS:GO Prime account, the real benefit is the lack of cheaters" March 2023
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwib64HLvPz9AhUPnf0HHV0tDJQQFnoECCAQAQ&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.esports.net%2Fnews%2Fcsgo%2Fcsgo-prime%2F&usg=AOvVaw2QD0iNDXcAGF8zRz7yZqHR

"The ability to play with only Prime players reduces the likelihood of encountering hackers dramatically." December 2022
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwib64HLvPz9AhUPnf0HHV0tDJQQFnoECCMQAQ&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.hotspawn.com%2Fcsgo%2Fnews%2Favoid-cheaters&usg=AOvVaw21vEeklrSh2B_kXEJzG_Dh

"CSGO matchmaking gets EVEN WORSE! (Cheaters, invalid PRIME & RANKS) | Luke-Eats " December 2022
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ljV93TI9avs

[Examples of people buying Prime accounts]
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwjYlJj9uvz9AhUNhf0HHT6qD3YQFnoECB0QAQ&url=https%3A%2F%2Fsteamcommunity.com%2Fapp%2F730%2Fdiscussions%2F0%2F2570942392193591729%2F&usg=AOvVaw3C0nvz0pLMec4OSFuuY_le

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwjYlJj9uvz9AhUNhf0HHT6qD3YQFnoECA8QAQ&url=https%3A%2F%2Fsteamcommunity.com%2Fapp%2F730%2Fdiscussions%2F0%2F1698293255135229850%2F&usg=AOvVaw1hJS5dnoMUQinYRHBibSwI

Literally Valve fucking says it themself...
-,-

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"It's not only about 5 coins, its *daily* 5 coins and Oh boy! If you believe people don't care about 5 daily coins, ask Fizzer how many people watches those long commercials :D He literally had to put limitation (every 16 hours) on people watching ads because there was not enough advertisement to watch "

.....
people who are already invested in the game.
Dude i dont think even you know what you are arguing for at this point anymore.
OBVIOUSLY people who are invested in the game care more for 5cents each day than fucking Bob and Joe who just came on.
Like do i really need to telll you that?

Dont bother replying.
I literally said everything there is to and continue to stand by that this sggestion is plain stupid and doesnt even achive what this thread is about on top of that.

"Why are you so focused on dismissing suggestions? I'm not complaining about your negative criticism, they are mostly on point and its helping us revize all the possible risks before implementation. But believing that other suggestions has their own massive problems without even having any objection about them is a prejudiced perspective, not a healthy way of looking at things... "

Yes and i can make that assumption for good reason.
You are neither an expert in marketing, game dev, or research in how to retain players.
The best points are literally the most broad points ever

"In order to keep more players we need to increase the enjoyment during their first play"
Nice good one me. Now im an expert -,-

Like no shit sherlock

Dont bother replying.

No, I don't communicate by ignoring people, I do it by replying. You can stop anytime you want though, I don't like forcing people to communicate.

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Literally Valve fucking says it themself...

Where? I look at all of your sources, some doesn't even open, some doesn't have anything about your quotes, some just supports my point by saying "Prime reduces possibility of encountering cheaters" or "hackers buying prime accounts"... None of your sources supported your claim (removing level-up prime to reduce cheaters).

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OBVIOUSLY people who are invested in the game care more for 5cents each day than fucking Bob and Joe who just came on.
Like do i really need to telll you that?

You don't need to tell me that, but apparently, you need me to tell you that lots of games gives out valuable stuff like coins to increase dopamine of the new players and associate their game with things like "fun and "reward". You might like it, you might hate it, but it works.

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I literally said everything there is to and continue to stand by that this sggestion is plain stupid and doesnt even achive what this thread is about on top of that.

We were having a civilized discussion please don't start throwing insults. I like to think that you are not a child who doesn't know enough words to express himself properly.

You are neither an expert in marketing, game dev, or research in how to retain players

Let me just say that you have dangerously bold and equally wrong assumptions about me :)

Players will be retained by playing the game, having fun, improving and so on. Not by coins or changing the whole level system and rewards. The players who are on this site didn't need coins, they needed experience and fun to play this game. No free wins or coins or something like that

Edited 3/27/2023 16:42:09

@vena

Yea, I never claimed that this new level-up system will revolutionize the game. I even directly told you that this level-up thing is not even a priority for me (Looks like you forgot to read it but don't worry, let me copy-paste it again to you: There were 7 suggestions about keeping the new players and level-up was only one of them. I'm mostly talking about level-up simply because Roi Joleil has so many questions about it...). However, this level-up thing is still a nice way to encourage new players to stay in this game which should be really beneficial for Fizzler.

Having more new players is always nice. Players that have found this site needs to play more than a couple of games. But that was also already mentioned

How can a group of people that all essentially want the same thing be so unfriendly to each other :(

> 2.7) Improve Rating System (Warzone's rating system is messed up, players don't match people from their skill level)

- I agree with this point. But still my main issue is; games with ratings like QM effecting win rates. Which means even if rating system is perfect, your WR should be around 50% as you play more in QM. Hence, good players will be discouraged from playing QM for their WR and new players will be discouraged from playing QM because rating system is not good enough.

Good players would not be discouraged by getting matched vs people that beat them half the time. That there is the dream. What we hate are getting matched vs people we can beat without even having to turn our brains on.

@alexclusive it is not "a group of people being unfriendly with each other". but just one single "problem bear" in this thread: roi joleil with his totally negative style.

veravari is highly constructive and totally civil, and admirably de-escalating.

OT: diagnosis of most immediate and severe problem is clear: way too high rate of quick drop-outs of new players. some good suggestions to improve situation have been made in this thread. fizzer's turn now to respond/give his perspective. what he deems feasible/desirable and what not.

@alexclusive
How can a group of people that all essentially want the same thing be so unfriendly to each other :(

I understand that you probably said this statement to not to point any fingers to anyone but since I'm also in this group of people that you call "unfriendly", I must disagree. I don't think I was being unfriendly.

To answer your question, I believe that when a person becomes too ambitious, they forget their primary objective (improve the game) and start to think solely about dominating other people. When other people keeps talking about improving the game, they feel frustrated for their inability to dominate others and in time, frustration becomes so unbearable that even feel forced to express that frustration. Which leads to these words that are not nice

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@Johnny Silverhand
Good players would not be discouraged by getting matched vs people that beat them half the time. That there is the dream. What we hate are getting matched vs people we can beat without even having to turn our brains on.

I checked your profile, of course you should know about yourself better than me but you also have a high WR, so I was curious about your Ladder and QM (places with ratings) performance. Even though you play this game for 4 years and you played more than a thousand 1v1 games, you almost never played ladders (only 1 1v1, 1 seasonal and 1 3v3 ladder) and QM (if you consistently won hundreds of QM game at your WR 78%, your QM rating should be around 2000, so this must mean that you never played enough QM to let your rating match your skill).

QM is the easiest place to find an opponent for 1v1 and ladders is a nice place to see your performance against others. Yet even you (a good player that doesn't mind having an average WR), avoid QM and Ladders (places where you get players, similar to your skill level). This should prove to Fizzer how alarming this situation has become. If even players doesn't mind loosing WR is actively avoiding them, they have to be much more inviting.

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@Rabbit of Caerbannog

veravari is highly constructive and totally civil, and admirably de-escalating.

Thanks for your kind words, I'm trying my best and its always feel nice to be appreciated for it.

I play the ladder infrequently mostly because I dislike MD games. MD feels like a chore, I prefer to sit down and play an entire game in one sitting than feel like I have to log in every day and play to avoid being booted.

I don't particularly avoid QM at all, but most of my boots are QM games, where I boot at picks, due to games taking a long time to start, and then them not making any noise when they do begin, so I change tabs/do something else while waiting for an opponent, and then get booted once it does start before I realize it did start.

ie. In my last 50 QM games I am 37-13, that's a 74% winrate, but 4 of those 13 losses were boots at picks. If those are wins that'd become 41-9, 82%, or if just not counted as wins or losses, 37-9, 80.4%.

I've never thought of MD like that, but sure. Also, everyone please keep the arguments civil. These were meant for discussions, not yelling matches.

Warzone on Steam would also help.

See https://warlight.uservoice.com/forums/77051-warzone-features/suggestions/18026512-steam-greenlight. Iirc in a AMA Fizzer said that Steam might not like the busness model of using ads.

What could work is letting people code their own AI (capable of surrendering) and hope that it would create decent SEAD/ SE1W/ strategic levels which could then be added to campaigns.

Players have written their own AIs before. The most commonly used ones are Wunderwaffe and Cowzow. They're part of autopilot. The AIs dont know how to surrender.

One person isn't enough to develop WZ. WZ would need to find a way how to monetize, so Fizzer can hire programmers and create ads for WZ.

Warzone has been 1 person since 2008. Mods and allow more features to be developed, ones which aren't necessarily on Fizzer's immediate roadmap. Pretty much all mods are member only and can't be used in mega games (because of performance reasons)

Improve the "accidental commit" system

Try voting for https://warlight.uservoice.com/forums/77051-warzone-features/suggestions/32684956--commit-confirmation-unity-on-phones-and-tablets

Edited 3/28/2023 10:36:18

@Johnny Silverhand
I play the ladder infrequently mostly because I dislike MD games

Yea, me too, both of our games are 71% real-time

I don't particularly avoid QM at all, but most of my boots are QM games

Which means you still avoid, just not for the reason I guessed

Even if you coincidentally happen to have different reasons to avoid all games with ratings, I'm sure you can understand my main point (win rate and ratings contradict each other). You only have a high win rate because you avoid games with ratings.

This contradiction will naturally have a negative effect on players. Because If I want a high win rate, I shouldn't play and game with rating. As I play games with rating, I get players around my skill level so my win rates will tend to decrease (which means my win rates will stop representing my performance).

To my knowledge, objective of such rates (win rate & ratings) is to determine a player's performance. If the main objective is different, please inform me. If I'm right, then the current way of determining a player's performance is simply inefficient. This inefficiency can easily be fixed by separation of win rate & ratings. If these inefficiencies are fixed, people will naturally be more inclined to play Warzone which will make the game more popular.

you guys are all fixated on nerd nonsense

like i said 3 pages ago people come here because they want to play the board game Risk online

not this idle warzone nonsense or whatever rating system nobody cares

change game name back to warlight, change marketing strategy, advertise this game as online Risk

boom easy