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Quickmatch suggestion: 2/18/2018 23:51:10

neal
Level 58
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https://warlight.uservoice.com/forums/77051-warzone-features/suggestions/33371260-quickmatch-rating-prereq

Add a button where it allows you to set a minimum global rating that your opponent must have in order to be matched. Very often I get matched with players who are new to the game and this has several downsides.
- I am not enjoying beating someone who doesn't understand the game (yet)
- I can't imagine them enjoying the way they loose without having a clue what they are doing wrong.

A gliding scale where you slowly get better opponents as you are improving in the game should be the most pleasing learning experience.

I would rather wait a little longer to get a matchup where I get challenged then to farm a lot of newbie players where neither of us enjoys the game

In order not to have to much confusing stuff for the new players there could be a minimum rating requirement you need to have before you can set a rating prereq. Or

In order not to make people abuse the system just allow to set a minimum required rating and not a maximum required rating


If you agree this could be a useful feature give it a vote on uservoice
Quickmatch suggestion: 2/19/2018 00:04:30


Quicksilver
Level 60
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I like this and would use.
Quickmatch suggestion: 2/19/2018 00:07:59


knyte 
Level 58
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+1; this would be especially useful for real-time games.
Quickmatch suggestion: 2/19/2018 00:10:33

Fizzer 
Level 59

Warzone Creator
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I see you play 99.9% real time games, and I believe the problem you're having is specific to real-time. I suggest trying some multi-day ones, too, as those will get you better matches.

The problem with RT is that your pool of players is limited to those who are searching for a game at the exact same moment as you. The QM system already tries to give you a good match, but if there are none close to your rating, it gradually expands its willingness to give you a poorer match the longer you (or the other player) have been waiting.

It sounds like your request is to adjust the real-time QM matching algorithm to wait longer for a better match.
Quickmatch suggestion: 2/19/2018 00:23:13

neal
Level 58
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I suggest trying some multi-day ones, too, as those will get you better matches


You are right my games are only in realtime. I am not a big fan of multiday games at all but i would consider trying this if the games were not a 1d6h boot. I am, due to work, very often offline in the weekends so 1d6h is just a guarantee for me to get booted a lot.

It sounds like your request is to adjust the real-time QM matching algorithm to wait longer for a better match


Not entirely correct. I would like the to see players are given the option to wait longer for a match if they prefer that. Like with coins there is a slider that you can set to the amount of coins you want to play for. Why not add a slider which minimum rating you wish to play?
Some players don't mind at all and just want a game as soon as possible. Others, like me, rather wait 15 minutes on a good match then play for an hour and match 4 newbie players
Quickmatch suggestion: 2/19/2018 00:36:25


knyte 
Level 58
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Also a real-time QMer and I think neal's point is correct. I'd be willing to wait even 30-50 minutes (w/ Warzone in a background tab) if that guaranteed me a better opponent.
Quickmatch suggestion: 2/19/2018 01:22:03


Quicksilver
Level 60
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Same - I would happily wait 30 mins for a good match.
Quickmatch suggestion: 2/19/2018 02:35:53


Platinum
Level 60
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If you really want to play competitive games in a real-time setting with high-skilled players to give you that "competitive" feeling.. Then Real-Time ladder should be the place for this requirement for high-skilled players to fight with each other in a ladder type mode.

Why doesn't people move to real-time ladder for this desire of "competitive games"?

Because the ladder is not fit for purpose. > https://www.warzone.com/Forum/296792-realtime-ladder-dying
Quickmatch suggestion: 2/19/2018 02:36:40


ViralGoat 
Level 59
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This game needs a boot time that is different in the weekend (1d m-f and 3d f-sun)
Quickmatch suggestion: 2/19/2018 02:58:30


knyte 
Level 58
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@Plat: also, QM gets way more activity than the RTL ever has. Casual players don't play on the RTL. A lot of casual players are actually really good, or at least decent enough to be worth waiting to play against.

Fixing the RTL won't solve this issue.

Edited 2/19/2018 02:59:03
Quickmatch suggestion: 2/19/2018 04:11:10

neal
Level 58
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well QM is everything that the RTL is not. Being able to veto templates, being able to vote on templates, not being able to see who is looking for a match so no matchfixing possible. Everything that has been asked for regarding the RTL is implemented in QM.

The fact that a 1500 rating is currently enough to rank top 10 says enough. It would be lower if not some people would have joined in the hope to get the golden trophy. I understand that you consider it a shame that something classic like the RTL has lost every attraction but why defending it when we got something much better? You try to make people come back to the RTL but you are not even playing it anymore yourself. Your last match was nearly 2 months ago

Regarding the ''competitive feeling''. I dont care so much for rankings, or winning. Ofc i do want to win when i play but i get more pleasure from a good match that i lost then a poor match that i won. The RTL being the competitive place is a joke, it was already dead before QM came.
The fact that i could take first place and ''break'' the longest win streak said enough over the average skill level. On QM i didnt even come close to a 38 game winstreak because QM is actually attracting the best of the best to play it.
And as knyte said, also the casual players can appreciate it. Nearly 5000 people played the RTL in almost 4 years. Nearly 17000 people have played QM in only a few months
Quickmatch suggestion: 2/19/2018 05:06:56


Rick Sanchez
Level 42
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@Knyte If most of casual players are decent to give a good game why is there calls for a suggestion of this type? This thread is essentially a talk of "How can we get better opponents instead of noobs to make it a "competitive game".

@Neal I don't advertise players to join the Real-Time ladder, It's shit. I'm saying the real-time ladder should have the same features as QM and it should be the place of "competitive" gaming since it is a ladder otherwise what's the point?

From: https://www.warzone.com/blog/index.php/2017/08/sneak-peek-quickmatch/

"Although you can think of quickmatch as a better real-time ladder," So of course, Fizzer would expect the best players to come here because it has the features the real-time ladder has been screaming out for. That's fine

But then..

". In fact, one of its goals is to make it easy for new WarLight players to start playing multi-player,"

If you have all the best players playing Quickmatch.. It makes playing Quickmatch difficult for a new player. Yes it's more accessible but it's more accessible to play against more experienced opponents that will kick your ass repetitively. I believe the newbie experience could be compared to playing Chess as a 1000 ELO to a 2000 ELO player. Yes there is a algorithm but I've matched with players with a significantly lower rating in under 10 seconds of me searching for a Quickmatch game. I play with my alt who was 650 rating at this stage.

Hence..

You could have a real-time ladder to suck all the top players from Quickmatch and have them in Real-time ladder. Increase the chances of newbies to play newbies.. Then when a newbie becomes good enough and becomes hungry for competition, They go Real-time ladder. Problem being the real-time ladder is shit hence why it should upgrade in transitioning quickmatch features to the ladder or it should not exist.

If Quickmatch was truly meant to be "as a better real-time ladder" the real-time ladder should be deleted or pursue this purpose above ^. If it did pursue this purpose above, This thread wouldn't be here. You have the choice of both worlds of less-stressed games or competitive as fuck games.
Quickmatch suggestion: 2/19/2018 05:46:22

TBest 
Level 60
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You can have a rating filter in chess, because the 'start' rating is typically 1500 and not 0. Hence you start approximately in the middleof the pack on all major websites.

Seeing as it is absolutely necessary for any game that new players get's a quick match(up) you can't have a rating filter that in practice blocks new players from playing the game. QM is more about active and quick game then an absolute skill competition. And based on the great number of players it's been an amazing success.

Don't mess with my QM please, right now it's perfect! Love the instant games. For the RTL do whatever you want.

Edit: Two things, wz doesn’t have the playerbase of chess, so matcups will always have a greater skill gap.

QM is also played on phones, where waiting is not acceptable.

Edited 2/19/2018 06:01:41
Quickmatch suggestion: 2/19/2018 06:10:49


knyte 
Level 58
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@Rick/Platinum: a lot != most. Most casual players are downright terrible and a waste of time to have to play against. There's some 30% win rate people you'll find even at a QM rating of 350+ especially now that QM is somewhat mature. QM is supposed to be the easy way of getting a good real-time game. This is hampered right now by the matchmaking. But at the same time retreating to the RTL to get good matchups won't work, because the strat community is still a relatively tiny portion of all good WZ players.

Fragmenting real-time players between QM and the RTL is a downright stupid idea imho. We should just let the RTL die at this point; it's been a shitshow from the start. QM also will never be a legit ladder- it can't be a competitive ranking mechanism when it's more focused on just being able to get a, well, quick match. Vetos and opponent selection easily compromise the validity of QM ratings, to say nothing of the rating system itself.

WZ is a casual game mostly populated by casual players. Unless that changes or the playerbase gets much larger, there's just never going to be enough room for the kind of RTL that you want. The best we can get right now is enhancing opponent selection in QM so you can at least have a good system of playing against players of your own caliber.

@TBest: this would be an opt-in thing. If you don't want to wait, don't wait. I'd just rather not get matched with another <L20 player who does the same stupid thing where they think Asia and North America are the best starts.

Edited 2/19/2018 06:11:56
Quickmatch suggestion: 2/19/2018 07:17:38


Cowboy 
Level 58
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I think the RTL could make a huge comeback if it had integration into unity. Up until this point the ladders have be pretty much pc only (some players use their mobile browser i know, but I'd bet most mobile players don't even know this site exists). Integrating the ladders into unity would definitely help increase all ladder participation.

That being said the RTL needs some work.
- New templates, preferably some that get cycled in every year. (I could see the voting system QM uses to work here very well)
- Rating degradation, whether it's resetting the ratings or implementing a MDL style activity bonus.
- Better alerts for when the game starts. I really love how QM just pops me into the game. The current system for the RTL just sucks.
Quickmatch suggestion: 2/19/2018 08:42:08


Mega Knight
Level 57
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Upvoted your suggestion.

MD QM is better in match-making, but yes 1d 6hr is too short at times.

MDL is right option if you are looking for highly competitive 3 day boot games-though it has limited vetoes.
Quickmatch suggestion: 2/19/2018 16:35:06

TBest 
Level 60
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@knyte
@TBest: this would be an opt-in thing. If you don't want to wait, don't wait. I'd just rather not get matched with another <L20 player who does the same stupid thing where they think Asia and North America are the best starts.

It's not opt-in, if you wait and I want to play. But I have to wait, since you are waiting. Sure, in theory there is enough non-waiters for that to never happen. But I don't know if that is true for WZ's playerbase. When it comes to #concurrent players, only Fizzer knows whether that would work.

The overall experience is better if you play 5 games, then get a good mach up - then if you wait ~45 min for the perfect match up. At least I would argue so. In practice this is what the RTL tried to compromise between with it's 5-min waiting time.

Clearly there is demand - at least on the forum - for a rework of the RTL. Just don't mess with my QM :P

My wishlist would be something like

1. Swiss (chess style) tournaments system.
2. New rating system for the ladders (maybe RTL to try it out) where you don't start at 0 in rating. GLICKO 2 or something. The current rating system and UI encourages rigging match ups.
3. Ladders added to unity
4. UJS all of unity

Edited 2/19/2018 17:35:25
Quickmatch suggestion: 2/20/2018 00:01:13

PJ 
Level 61
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RTL needed an overhaul but has now been overtaken by QM big time. And QM is really great and what WZ needed! Great work fizzer! Would be cool to knows some statistics how successful it really is.

I'd now rather make strategic RT and MD QM leaderboards of some kind -maybe just the ones we already have- and give these a prominent place and a trophy or so. And focus on improving QM with ideas from the community instead of fixing RTL. I'd even remove the RTL.

I'm sure there will be plenty of ideas coming to improve QM step by step to serve within one and the same system the new players, the majority of the players, and the strategic elite..
Quickmatch suggestion: 2/21/2018 16:17:10


Beren • apex 
Level 63
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My solution to the RTL is that when you click to join a RT QM there's a check box asking if you want this to be a "ranked game". If both players want a ranked game the game counts for your RTL rating, otherwise it only counts for QM. That way you don't dilute the playerbase with 2 competing RT player pools.

This might help with neal and knyte's problems as well if you prioritize matching players who both want ranked games, since better players are more likely to want them.

Edited 2/21/2018 16:19:21
Quickmatch suggestion: 2/21/2018 19:34:27


knyte 
Level 58
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+1 Beren
Quickmatch suggestion: 2/21/2018 20:07:34


DanWL 
Level 62
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^^might cause confisuion between ranked games and practice games. It should be clear for to tell if you are using QM for the RTL.

Edit: ww

Edited 2/21/2018 20:42:04
Quickmatch suggestion: 2/21/2018 20:16:06


knyte 
Level 58
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Using the word "ranked" is probably not optimal but that's a minor thing. But subsuming the RTL into QM is gonna get it so much more activity while preserving the existence of a legitimately competitive real-time ladder.

Edited 2/21/2018 20:16:35
Quickmatch suggestion: 2/21/2018 21:09:21


linberson 
Level 61
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Gave it 3 votes.

In general I can only agree that RTL is dead, and I would very much like to see it renewed or integrated into the QM system.
Quickmatch suggestion: 2/22/2018 05:24:59


Ekstone 
Level 55
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This is a very interesting topic with very interesting ideas!

But the basis of everything is the player pool.
And the present playerbase of the WarZone is simple not enough for a more perfect matching algorithm (at least for the real time part sure).

Maybe this is (player pool) why Fizzer put in one page the whole Quickmatch part (better chance to not separated this player pool into even smaller parts, or I don't know)

Anyway, I checked the Quickmatch page, and it is not very unequivocal (I can say it is unclear).
Why a button, a checkbox and a slider with actually the same function? :O Very confusing.
I mean, why not three simple opt-in button (for realtime, multiday, coins), and if you click on one of the opt-in button, it turns into opt-out button and appear a new block below the button for more settings of that part. Those buttons would be more clear imo.

And back to the player pool topic, there is one more thing about the QM system I don't understand.
Why the multiday QM system don't use the standard 3 day auto boot settings?
I mean, the 3 days are used in everywhere (ladders, community events, most public MD tournaments, etc.), and this is not a coincidence, that is a "perfect" auto boot settings for multiday games.
With this 1d6h setting, you cut back the QM MD player pool a lot! I mean, the present QM MD players would still join MD games if QM MD system would use 3 days auto boot settings, but players who can't solve the daily WZ playing, never will join to the 1d6h system. Why is this good Fizzer?

Or is this conscios? Separate this way the QM players and the Ladder players?
Still I think this is not a good idea.

I think WZ doesn't need a QM system AND a ladder system in parallel.
I think Fizzer should merge the two systems into one.
And I am not speaking about only the RTL, but all the ladders! (for merging the team ladders, need some QM improvements (for example option you can set favourite team member(s), creating constant teams, etc.)

A newbie player's path can be the following:
1. for unlocking the multiplayer part, she/he need collect WZ points by playing single player games, to learn the basics
2. for unlocking the multiplayer ranking system, she/he need collect QM points by playing unranking QM games, to improve her/his skills for the harder competitive games
3. play in the QM ranking system (which is merged with the present ladders)

So there would be two check boxes: Ranked games, Unranked games. These check boxes appear only after a certain QM level.
And would be flexible. So after you reach that QM level, you can choice you want to play only ranked games, only unranked games or both (for example some days you want only play anything but not hard way (check only the unranked box), some day you want only play competitive games (check only the ranked box), and the rest days nevermind (checked both))

And the QM ranking lists would be public just like now the ladders.
Quickmatch suggestion: 2/22/2018 05:44:07


Ekstone 
Level 55
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And one more things about the player pool.

In the poker the player pool consists of two parts:
  • the regular players
  • the hobby players (fishes)
There are much much more hobby players than regular players.
And the hobby players put the money in the system while the regular players only take out the money.
Despite these, the regular poker players still important for the Poker site (even if they are competitors for the hobby players' money) because the regular players can give the baseline of the continous games.

Here in the WarZone similar situation.
There are not many regular players, there are much more hobby (occassionally) players.
Likely the hobby players make much more moneys for Fizzer than regulars.
But the regular players play much more than the hobby players, so they give a base player pool for WarZone.
And don't forget, they do it for free.

This is why I don't understand why Fizzer ignores the sounds of these reg players so much :P
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