Tabby, are you really onboard with racialism? Sigh.

Civilization =/= genetics. Civilization == culture. Have you read The Selfish Gene yet?

I said racialism, not racism: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racialism, or, better, http://www.thefreedictionary.com/racialism. Sorry for the confusion. I just mean, do you believe races are a valid concept for humans?

Edited 11/27/2016 06:54:34

^Races are legitimate concepts only to some extant (appearance).

Are you sure about that? I don't think there's ever been such a thing as a definitive definition (of appearance) for any human races that is not exceptionally blurry at the edges to the point where the 'edges' don't even exist.

Biologically speaking we need to change what race means to make it a completely genetic concept.

Biologically speaking, this has been attempted and has failed miserably, much for the same reasons as above. People have tried to define human races biologically. They can't. It doesn't work. It's a smooth landscape, not a bunch of islands.

Anyway, I don't want to derail the thread too much on this tangent, so I won't delve into this further here. But I do urge you to read The Selfish Gene. And, come to think of it, you would also get a lot out of Jared Diamond's book, Guns, Germs, and Steel (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guns,_Germs,_and_Steel).

"it would be very, very crazy to say that ~48-49% of Americans are racist, sexist, homophobic, misogynistic, etc."

I'm not sure that'd be crazy at all.

I'd actually say 70-80% fit that to be honest.

I don't consider someone racist because they want to hang africans, I consider them racist if they feel people of specific races are superior to others. I consider the man that will pay a white man more than a black man racist, even if he isn't conscious of the reason himself.

Similarly, any man that feels insecure about his girlfriend being taller than him, or making more money than him is sexist in my eyes. You don't have to hate women and think they should be abused to be sexist If you think it's mens responsibility to be the bread-earners, and womens to raise the kids, and that as such your other half exceeding your income makes you less of a man - then you're sexist.

Then again, I make no secret of being elitist. I don't merely consider a large percentage of the population to be racist or sexist. I consider them to be stupid, unmotivated, and incompetent.

You might have had a lot of things handed to you on a platter. I didn't, I grew up raised by a single mother who struggled to survive. We lived in government subsidized housing when I was younger. She put herself through college when I began school, and she is now 87th percentile among Americans in regards to income. I got two masters degrees from the best university in Michigan, and my early income is in the 97th percentile. I'm not empathetic to most people that claim they had no opportunities. They had opportunities. Probably more than I had. They squandered them. I didn't. Shame on them.

Edited 11/27/2016 16:22:50

I'd refer to the American industrial worker as the Americanitas; the citizen/worker/soldier, the modern equivalent of the Roman Romanitas. Both of these groups form the backbone of their respective republics. How did Rome lose the Romanitas and subsequently beginto decay? Importing cheap labor. Well to be more precise, slaves. Many slaves from the areas Rome conquered. This put the Romanitas out of work and led to the destruction of this class and subsequently, the Republic. The modern equivalent would be somewhat outsourcing, and somewhat immigration. If you do not maintain the Americanitas by getting rid of regulations, the minimum wage, lowering taxes and equalizing tariffs to make it reasonably profitable to work in the US, you will succumb like the Roman Republic did.

I don't consider someone racist because they want to hang africans, I consider them racist if they feel people of specific races are superior to others. I consider the man that will pay a white man more thana lack man racist, even if he isn't conscious of the reason himself.

Similarly, any man that feels insecure about his girlfriend being taller than him, or making more money than him is sexist in my eyes. You don't have to hate women and think they should be abused to be sexist If you think it's mens responsibility to be the bread-earners, and womens to raise the kids, and that as such your other half exceeding our income makes you less of a man - then you're sexist.

Well sexism and racism then isn't really that bad of a thing

no BAD DOG go back to DOGHOUSE

No, knyte. It goes more like this:

*Raises legitimate concern about the economy or illegal immigration*
"Fuck off, racist"

THAT is the attitude that got Trump elected.

"Racist" has become a buzzword used to discredit anyone a said person disagrees with. Yes, there are still real racists out there, but now a boy who cried wolf situation has been made.

Everybody who voted Trump is personally responsible for the bullying that knyte went through in his youth. And because both bullies and White blue collars are stupid people, all members of the White working class are bullies.

There's very few racists that appreciate being called racist. Unfortunately, we stigmatized the label far more than the actual act of racism.

Doesn't matter a bit to me, though, if The Lord, Adrijan, and others get triggered when they get called what they are. The game we're playing is already stacked in my favor- it's why I make no effort to even bother with their approval.

Edited 11/28/2016 00:28:17

Tabby is a racist

Tabby is a racist.

@knyte: if you think the White working class is becoming obsolete, what do you think will happen with all the uneducated blacks and hispanics who statistically earn less, are more often unemployed and commit more crime?

Tabby, stop feeding trolling. Just downvote and move on. Seriously.

You might be sarcastic, but there are a couple things that are important to me.

1: Did the spouse of the person I'm voting for engage in consensual sex.

2: Can a 67 year old use emails.

After typing those out in simple sentences, they might seem really unimportant, but that's how I choose my President. Plus, the baby kill'n, gun stealing, socialist stuff.

Now don't you be trying to talk me out of it, with your insulting liberal brainwashing education sorta stuff. You might think you're smart with all your fancy 6 letter words, but every time you type one of them out that I can't pronounce I'm going to figure you're insulting me, and vote against the liberal elites.

---

@The Lord:

If a robot can do your job for cheaper and you're not willing to learn a new field, it's gg. Don't expect the rest of us to try and "bring back" jobs in economic sectors where we lost our comparative advantage decades ago. If I wake up tomorrow and it turns out that someone in Vietnam or Poland- or a robot- has the same skills as me and is able to do my job for cheaper, I'm not going to demand that you try and keep my job alive. I'm going to use every resource at my disposal to build my skills and remain economically productive. When light-bulbs got invented, we had to leave candle-making behind- that's just how markets and technology work- if you're not competitive, don't expect to get a job. Work to build new skills- those resources exist and in quite overwhelming quantities at this point, market yourself, and if you legitimately see no way out, don't decide to shove other people under the bus when you're offered opportunities to fix your life.

I really don't buy into the "robots will take all of our jobs" argument, either- it's just the same pattern of automation ending old fields and creating new industries, except much faster this time. I'm fine with basic income in any case (since it scraps the bureaucracy of welfare and allows for more entrepreneurship by giving everyone a baseline of capital to work with), but if you're a person there will always be some way for you to contribute to society. No excuses.

Latinos/Hispanic workers at least (for the most part) didn't vote against free/cheap job training that would allow them to transition to more competitive sectors. If you're a member of the white working class, you had your shot, you turned it down- and regardless of the reasons you had, that's gg. No brownies for you.

Edited 11/28/2016 02:04:52

If I wake up tomorrow and it turns out that someone in Vietnam or Poland- or a robot- has the same skills as me and is able to do my job for cheaper, I'm not going to demand that you try and keep my job alive

Something you're forgetting is that the policies you advocate for ran up the costs of hiring Americans and that drove the jobs elsewhere. You pretend that it's Americans just being outcompeted, but that's simply not the case, it's regulations, taxes and the minimum wage that drove jobs out of the country.

^^How is the white working class community inherently different from the Latino one?

"Ohohoh, you see dear chap, the Latinos agree with me and the whites don't, so the whites are clearly mentally deficient and inferior ohohoh!"

Something you're forgetting is that the policies you advocate for ran up the costs of hiring Americans and that drove the jobs elsewhere. You pretend that it's Americans just being outcompeted, but that's simply not the case, it's regulations, taxes and the minimum wage that drove jobs out of the country.

Which policies are we talking about? Free trade? Minimum wages? Not building a wall on our border?

If someone has a comparative advantage, that's it. That's game. We can't stop it in the medium or long term- the only solution is to move to industries where we have a comparative advantage.

Do we have policies that are making coal/steel more expensive here than abroad? Of course we do. Will getting rid of those policies make enough of a dent to get a meaningful number of these jobs "back" from China- no.

Get with the times, or go die. Take out the sugarcoating we have in our political system, and that's the cold reality we have to work with.

There's massive deficits of skilled labor in plenty of other fields where we have a serious comparative advantage (that will only grow as our labor deficits shrink)- shifting our resources there is the only path forward. Not repealing NAFTA (I'm certainly not gonna enjoy having to pay state income tax in Texas when our economy and government revenues shrink as a result). Not throwing arbitrary taxes at people and industries you don't like. Just adapting rationally to actual market conditions.

It's called the market; I thought you claimed to understand it.

"Ohohoh, you see dear chap, the Latinos agree with me and the whites don't, so the whites are clearly mentally deficient and inferior ohohoh!"

I'm not here to divide along racial lines- if you're a Rust Belt worker, you're not going to get your manufacturing job back. And if you're a Rust Belt worker who just voted against a comprehensive job training program because you think that "renegotiating our trade deals" or forcing Apple to make iPhones domestically with the shitty excuse for labor you put on the table, you're a special kind of stupid.

Edited 11/28/2016 02:39:51

Which policies are we talking about? Free trade? Minimum wages?

Minimum wage (and economic interventions as a whole). Trumps not an advocate of taking this away, unfortunately, but it is one of the things you can attribute job loss to.

I'm not here to divide along racial lines- if you're a Rust Belt worker, you're not going to get your manufacturing job back

I would if you're not putting your regulations on the table forcing companies to move overseas.

shitty excuse for labor

"You see, it's all your fault, I obviously did not make you more expensive for companies to work with! It's all your fault I dindu nuffin!" (Now comes Knyte claiming dindu nuffin is racist)

Edited 11/28/2016 02:42:08

Smegma is a racist.