Even for those who believe gay marriage is acceptable to God, most would still consider Sodom to have been sexually immoral due to rampant promiscuity and attempted homosexual gang rape. It would be incorrect to conclude that those cities were destroyed because of monogamous, loving, devoted, homosexual relationships.

My friends and relatives who are gay are really great people. I can't imagine a loving and fair God sending them to eternal hell for being part of a devoted gay relationship.

The problem is that Homosexuality is incompatible with Christianity, so most Homosexuals have to be atheists. Since they are unconverted individuals, they go to Hell.

It's not even the sin of committing sexual immorality that is bad. Everyone is a sinner. What is incompatible is the belief that Sexual immoralities are Okay.

I mean come on, why would you want to spend eternity with someone who won't even acknowledge that you exist?

Edited 5/20/2015 22:43:31

Here's a relevant excerpt from a conversation with Colonel:

If you say so. I don't really believe anything I write. I am Muslim, and I am anti-Zionist but I don't hate Jews or judge people based on their sexuality in real life. I'm fairly moderate. It was a challenge to beat Lawlz for the title of "Most Controversial Thread Ever on WarLight".

This one actually admits to trolling, and you all have fallen for it. gg





Screenshot proof, though it doesn't really matter:

Link to private mail thread, though only two people can read it: https://www.warlight.net/Discussion/?ID=83169

Edited 5/20/2015 22:49:56

Here is it applied to some examples:

If Someone who lives in the US doesn't believe that it is morally wrong to murder, then when they murder they have not committed a crime and are not a criminal.

If a father tells his son not to steal some candy, and the son doesn't believe that it is morally wrong to steal candy, then when he does steal candy he is not a thief and he has not committed theft."

If God tells you not to have sex with your mom, and you believe that it is not morally wrong to have sex with your mom, then when you have sex with your mom you have not committed sin and are not a sinner.

Saying that you do not believe that a higher power(The US Government, Your Dad, God) exists does not exempt you from the law.

If that higher power is the government, you will still be guilty of a crime, and you will still be a convicted criminal after you are caught, whether or not you believe that the government exists.

If that higher power is your dad, you'll Probably still get grounded whether or not you believe that your dad exists.

If that Higher power is God, you are still a sinner and will receive due punishment for your sins in the afterlife.

Again, you did not read my point. You cannot equate God (you choose to follow) to Government (you must follow if you live in their territory). I never said people can choose what laws to obey. I simply said you cannot hold another person to a chosen higher authority if they did not choose that higher authority themselves.

Also God is the creator of all things and the ultimate judge. If something is a sin it is a sin whether or not a person follows Christ or believes in God.

That is pretty dumb. So every human must abide by the laws of ALL gods that someone believe in or they are a 'sinner'? Guaranteed EVERY person on earth is a 'sinner' in the eyes of at least one religion.

The problem is that Homosexuality is incompatible with Christianity, so most Homosexuals have to be atheists. Since they are unconverted individuals, they go to Hell.

Exactly my point. There are probably homosexual Christians that exist but hope for change (can't assume there are not). But, I would bet %99 of homosexual people are not Christian. Why would you follow a church that says you are not equal?

So if you do not belong to that faith, you cannot be a sinner in that faith either. You can only judge a person IF they were in your faith. Not as if they ARE in the faith.

Again, you did not read my point. You cannot equate God (you choose to follow) to Government (you must follow if you live in their territory). I never said people can choose what laws to obey. I simply said you cannot hold another person to a chosen higher authority if they did not choose that higher authority themselves.

My point isn't that laws have to be obeyed, but that if you don't obey them than you are a violator of them.

The reason I made this point is because you made it a point to say that People who sin but are not Christians are Not sinners.

Ultimately, Following God's laws are exactly the same as following laws laid forth by governments. You do have the choice to follow them, and If you don't follow them, there are consequences.

Edited 5/20/2015 23:44:30

My friends and relatives who are gay are really great people. I can't imagine a loving and fair God sending them to eternal hell for being part of a devoted gay relationship.

I have no doubt that there are many homosexuals that are nice people. Most people are fairly good people but everyone sins and have a particular sin they struggle with. God does not accept homosexuality in any form. It is unnatural and unsafe. "Devoted" gay relationships are almost nonexistent. A couple gay researches once studied 500 homosexuals and their relationships; not a single one remained faithful.

1 Corinthians 6:9 says "Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals,nor sodomites, nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God." This is the plain and simple truth. This does not mean God is unloving or unfair because see what the next verse says: "And such were some of you. But you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus and by the Spirit of our God."

Every sin is deserving of death, that is stated not only in the beginning of the Bible but also in Romans. However God sent Christ Jesus because He loves us and does not want people to suffer the punishment, so Jesus took the punishment Himself though he was innocent. However to be saved you must be obedient. Peter told the Jews in Acts 2:38 that you must "Repent, and let every one of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins."

Condoning homosexuality is doing the opposite of that. It is encouraging people to remain in sin.

The point Imperator brought is an excellent argument, because it refutes "Islamic" extremists.

If an American is in Britain, and he commits homicide, nobody would agree that the Brits should use capital punishment in Britain simply because the murderer is American. The same goes for anyone, of any race, religion or sect.

I'm not reading giant paragraphs of text, but

I had no interaction with someone who was not heterosexual.

This is highly unlikely to be true. You have had no real-life interaction with openly gay people, because there is a serious social stigma attached to it in your social circles. However, you can be sure that you know actively gay people in real life; they just won't tell you about it.

Similarly, I don't know of any bigoted assholes in my real life. I'm sure I actually know a few, but it's just not normal for someone in my social circles to be openly bigoted, because it would (quite rightly) lead to ostracization.

This is how i see it as a Christian, I believe the homosexuals are wrong but like people before me said you cant judge someone unless you are God. Being a Christian lets say i fathered a son how turned out to be a homosexual, there is nothing i can do to him except pray that he will come to his senses and see that they route his taking is not the right route.

I disagree that you cannot judge someone unless you are God. Are you saying I cannot judge a mass murderer or terrorist? it does not mean I am allowed to seek retribution, but I am certainly welcome to hate their guts. I don't abide by the forgive and forget in all situations. There are different degrees of sins/immoral acts.

For example, something like taking the lord's name in vain (if you believe that is a sin) is not the same as taking a life.

Edited 5/22/2015 18:14:03

To judge, in the sense of as it is used in the New Testament, is referring to telling people that they are going to Heaven or going to Hell, if they are good or evil. Of course, the basis of civilization is law and order, which is why Jesus told the people to follow the law (while never denying God's existence). Unlike murder, homosexuality does not involve anyone on the outside of the situation, which is why it is considered a moral sin, but doesn't have to be against the law, so if homosexuality is legal, nobody has any right to put any sort of judgement on any gay people. Nobody is supposed to judge anyone in the first place, though. Keeping a truly open mind and not deciding judgement on someone for yourself is Christian.

Edited 5/23/2015 02:29:12

I disagree that you cannot judge someone unless you are God. Are you saying I cannot judge a mass murderer or terrorist? it does not mean I am allowed to seek retribution, but I am certainly welcome to hate their guts. I don't abide by the forgive and forget in all situations. There are different degrees of sins/immoral acts.

Actually, if you hate anyone than you are a murderer(Actual quote from the bible).

To judge, in the sense of as it is used in the New Testament, is referring to telling people that they are going to Heaven or going to Hell, if they are good or evil. Of course, the basis of civilization is law and order, which is why Jesus told the people to follow the law (while never denying God's existence). Unlike murder, homosexuality does not involve anyone on the outside of the situation, which is why it is considered a moral sin, but doesn't have to be against the law, so if homosexuality is legal, nobody has any right to put any sort of judgement on any gay people. Nobody is supposed to judge anyone in the first place, though. Keeping a truly open mind and not deciding judgement on someone for yourself is not Christian.

Firstly, It is like, a huge screw-up to teach anyone, especially sinners, that sin is Okay.

See matthew 5:19:

Whoever therefore breaks one of the least of these commandments, and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever does and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

It is the believers responsibility to teach non-believers the the requirements for living in God's kingdom. These requirements are that you Confess your sins before God and acknowledge that you have wronged, and then to ask for forgiveness.

Also, it's nonsense that you can't tell another person the consequences of not believing; All that is forbidden is condemning a person, A duty which God has reserved for himself.

Consider these two statements:

You will go to Hell because of your sins.

If you do not Give your life to Jesus Christ, you will Go to Hell.

One of these statements is Passing judgement, which is forbidden in the bible, and one is not.

nobody has any right to put any sort of judgement on any gay people.

All this means is that You are not able to Condemn people to hell. You are allowed, and in fact required to, warn people of the consequences their sins will have.

In fact, the verse you quote from matthew 7 is referring to something different; Read it in context:

“Judge not, that you be not judged. 2 For with what judgment you judge, you will be judged; and with the measure you use, it will be measured back to you. 3 And why do you look at the speck in your brother’s eye, but do not consider the plank in your own eye? 4 Or how can you say to your brother, ‘Let me remove the speck from your eye’; and look, a plank is in your own eye? 5 Hypocrite! First remove the plank from your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother’s eye.

This verse clearly does not mean what you think it does. In the context of your post, Gay people who are married and commit Sexual immoralities again and again have no right to Judge A teenager who has homosexual thoughts.

Edited 5/22/2015 20:26:23

One of the worst ideas that has been perpetuated through Christianity is this idea of not convicting anyone of sin. The Bible teaches that we need to rebuke and correct people who are sinning with love and kindness. Not hypocritical judgment, and certainly not ignoring sin. Nothing is worse than "feel good Christianity" because it does absolutely no good for an individual.

In the beginning of Acts Peter says right out that the people crucified the Son of God and that they need to repent and be baptized for the remission of sin. The people upon hearing this realized what they had done and repented. If Peter had said "oh don't worry about it we all make mistakes" Christianity wouldn't have gotten very far.

Jesus himself pointed out when people were wrong. Throughout the gospels He rebuked the Pharisees, and told the Samaritan woman her sins, He acknowledged the adulterous woman's sin and told her to go and sin no more, He rebuked his apostles for a lack of faith, etc. However He did all this to bring them to repentance and to live more righteously.

Everyone are sinners whether it is because of homosexuality, lying, disobedience, fornication, adultery, drunkeness; everyone is guilty of something. God is willing to forgive though, as long as you repent from doing those things and are baptized in the water to be cleansed from sin.

Amen

Actually, if you know you feel guilt to the bottom of your soul, if you are truly sorry, if you apologize and confess, one can be forgiven of a sin such as murder.

The Church now accepts The LGBT community as long as they accept God.

"The Church" however does not define all of Christianity. There are several Christians who are perfectly willing to do whatever they can to stop the promotion of Homosexuality.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3087624/Christian-owned-bakery-refused-make-Bert-Ernie-gay-marriage-cake-GUILTY-discrimination.html

Edited 5/23/2015 00:29:46