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40+ Member Inactive Clan?: 6/22/2022 14:10:46


Major Tom
Level 24
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This is Major Tom to Ground Control. I was just wondering if there were any inactive 40+ member clans that I could take over for a massive clan of my own. The whole 40 player clans don't seem like they would be as effective as the larger member clans seem to be. If you happen to know an inactive 40+ member clan that you think could be willingly to let me be the new leader and stuff, that would be super fantastic. Also, if you own an inactive 40+ member clan and don't mind me becoming the leader and stuff, that would ALSO be super fantastic. Thanks!
40+ Member Inactive Clan?: 6/23/2022 04:50:43


l4v.r0v 
Level 59
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I've got a couple. What do you plan to do with the clan? Your profile doesn't inspire much confidence tbh.
40+ Member Inactive Clan?: 6/23/2022 12:54:39


Major Tom
Level 24
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Apologies for the unappealing profile. But believe me, I have a plan. I kind of want to have a discord, as I feel like that could be beneficial. I also hope for active members that would strive to participate in a wide array of whatever clan events and things that there are. Another thing that I've seen done by clans like The Last Alliance, Le Furie Azzure, and The Fancy Dot- where they have different groups within their clan. I would want to do that and have a set of different divisions to have a better appeal to those that tend to favor either diplo style or Strat. style or both. If they favor neither... well, I'm sure I could figure something out.
I've done much research, trying to figure out how this whole Clan thing could work. I figured it could be really fun and entertaining, hyping up my competitive side to a new high.
Thank you for your consideration!
40+ Member Inactive Clan?: 6/23/2022 14:53:17


καλλιστηι 
Level 61
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https://www.warzone.com/Clans/?ID=442 is an available, mostly dead clan, but you must have a no-idle in the chat policy and don't kick people already in it.
Another possibility, if you don't mind co-leading, is joining our clan. We have an active community and planning to recruit more people and increase the number of clan events. This option would probably be easier for you, as creating a clan from scratch can be an immense pain.
40+ Member Inactive Clan?: 6/23/2022 16:19:51


Major Tom
Level 24
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I appreciate the offer. I am more so looking for an inactive clan that has over 40 people in it as I personally think that the 40 people limit could be restrictive. Although, if need be, I can absolutely take it and run with it. There are some pretty good clans that are only just below 40 so *shrug*.
I believe I could be ready to start a clan from scratch. I've put together some plans for it, and I'm just trying to figure out the hard part, in my eyes: Getting a clan.
Thank you for your offer! I will definitely consider it. But for now, I'm just looking for a 40+ member inactive clan that I could take over and reinvent.
40+ Member Inactive Clan?: 6/23/2022 19:58:57


καλλιστηι 
Level 61
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Both clans I mentioned have less than 40 members, but don't have a cap (so if you recruit, they can have more than 40).
40+ Member Inactive Clan?: 6/24/2022 05:11:19


l4v.r0v 
Level 59
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I've done much research, trying to figure out how this whole Clan thing could work. I figured it could be really fun and entertaining, hyping up my competitive side to a new high.
From experience, if you want to do what you suggested, you should try it on an existing active (but low-value) clan first. Your approach isn't good for building a new clan from the ground up but for adding value to a clan that already has some members.
40+ Member Inactive Clan?: 6/24/2022 10:22:55


alexclusive 
Level 64
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You need a group of people to start a clan realistically, doing it alone is very unlikely to work out. You need appealing features that make people choose your clan, an existing group of people is kind of the minimum.
40+ Member Inactive Clan?: 6/24/2022 11:17:14


JK_3 
Level 62
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Samek and Hodop both started from nothing, without appealing features, and their clans are doing pretty well. They both were active in global chat tho, which gave them the ability to quickly attract a few people to get it going.
40+ Member Inactive Clan?: 6/24/2022 11:22:40


Samek ● 
Level 57
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I started a clan from scratch roughly a year ago and it recently ranked 8th place in Clan Wars.

While I feel in your frustrations with the member cap, I have been able to succeed with my clan mates in spite of it. Honestly, your not gaining much taking another's clan.

My opinion but good luck to ya!
40+ Member Inactive Clan?: 6/24/2022 14:14:52


Major Tom
Level 24
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I have made games to recruit members, so I could already, potentially have some members.
I have to go somewhere today in about 30 ish minutes, but when I come back, I could try dabbling in the Global chat. If I did take over another clan, and it was inactive, then it wouldn't be as effective as starting up my own, knowing if the members would be active or not.
So I'm definitely more on board with JK and Samek's ideas. And although the 40+ clan idea sounds really, really good, Samek said he made it work...
I don't know, but I think that might just be the route that I end up taking.
40+ Member Inactive Clan?: 6/26/2022 05:54:44


NEET King
Level 58
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@Samek I disagree, there's definitely an advantage. Take a look at current CW stats for example:

M'Hunters: 75 players, 40 participating
NEETs: 40 players, 23 participating

If NEETs had 75 members we would have close to 40 people participating I'd bet. If M'Hunters wanted to be competitive in clan wars and had a 40 member cap, what do you think they would have to do? They would have to setup more strict rules and remove more players from their clan. They don't have to do that and can still get a 100% participation rate while other clans like NEETs, Excel and Myth Busters can't. It would be reasonable for the total member limit to be raised to 60. Clan wars would be more competitive, if Myth Busters had an additional 20 members, they would be ahead of M'Hunters right now IMO. M'Hunters quickly got to 100% clan wars participation this season while Myth Busters still hasn't gotten there...

You can't expect 40 member clans to have a 100% participation rate - even if they do, it will take longer and give an inherent advantage to older clans with more members. Which means the older clans will rack up more wins and rank higher. Just the way it is, hope Fizzer changes the clan size to 60 one day...

Edited 6/26/2022 05:57:15
40+ Member Inactive Clan?: 6/26/2022 09:38:27


JK_3 
Level 62
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You can't expect 40 member clans to have a 100% participation rate - even if they do, it will take longer and give an inherent advantage to older clans with more members. Which means the older clans will rack up more wins and rank higher.


Yeah, to fix this Fizzer either needs to get rid of the cap (maybe selling clan upgrades?), or he needs to lower the participation limit in CW to 25.

Edited 6/26/2022 09:38:51
40+ Member Inactive Clan?: 6/26/2022 15:10:20


AbsolutelyEthan 
Level 62
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There’s a whole bunch of inactive old style clans. I’d recommend that your best bet is to go to the clans list and start at the bottom. Find old clans that are dead and DM the owner. They should get an email if they haven’t touched the game, and one of them may just say ‘sure why not’.


*Edit
Also, samek has a SDC episode about starting a clan. You should check it out.

Edited 6/26/2022 15:12:00
40+ Member Inactive Clan?: 6/26/2022 18:14:16


Major Tom
Level 24
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UPDATE:

I now have my own clan and will begin the Recruitment process soon.

Thanks for all the support and help!

Yours truly,
Major Tom
40+ Member Inactive Clan?: 6/26/2022 18:59:15


alexclusive 
Level 64
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Good luck, man! :)
40+ Member Inactive Clan?: 6/27/2022 20:46:40


krinid 
Level 61
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Of course it's "an advantage" to have an older clan, that's not the point to debate. The advantage is simply that you can have non-CW active players and still remain competitive in CW without booting them and inviting CW active players. That preserves your clan community without having to tailor it to CW activity.

HOWEVER . . . what people are actually calling out here is that while this is an advantage, it won't make you successful at CW. To do that, you need ... (shocker) ... CW active players. Obvious, I know ... but yet the most difficult part for any clan to get, players who consistently play CW. To do that, you need to find players who are actually interested in CW, else they'll just play for a while and fade out. If you're lucky, you'll get a full season out of them. And once you get a bunch of players cycling through interested & active, active but losing interest, active and lost interest, semi-active out of obligation, not active, not playing at all, you lose the ability to be competitive.

I haven't even talked about WR here b/c it's secondary to activity. WR is of course good (even necessary), but it's meaningless without activity. 100% WR with 2 games played per season won't even get you into the top 10, let alone make you competitive. But it's all relative, you for the most part just need to be more "better" (higher WR or more active) or p (and necessary to be truly competitive, notably higher than your next competitor, it's).

How do you get high participation? You organize it. You need to have minimally 1 but preferably 2-3 members organizing people to play games, motivating people to play, people helping out to train teammates, etc. If you just leave it to the players to manage themselves, you'll likely get medium participation at best.

So ... let's look at history, the most successful clans in CW through all the seasons:
* = clan with 40 member cap
- Masters - very high WR, high activity, won every season they maintained this for, then activity dropped and they dropped out of the top 5
- MH - high WR, high activity, won every season that Masters wasn't active in until MB showed up
- *MB - high WR, high activity, won both seasons they maintained this for
- TSFH/Harmony - low WR, high activity, could never eclipse MH (except for the anomaly S1), "perpetual 3rd place", good enough to take 3rd place
- *Python - high WR, low participation, 3rd place in the one season (S1) they cared to play in
- Yolo - pre-cursor to MB, medium WR, medium participation, simply displaced TSFH (Harmony) from 3rd place, could not crack MH or Masters without more participation but take an authoritative 3rd place
- TLA - low/med WR, medium participation, took over the "perpetual 3rd place" role when TSFH, Harmony dropped out
- *Excel - low/med WR, medium participation, making a play to take over as new "perpetual 3rd", got 3rd place 1 season
- *NEETs - med WR, medium participation, took 3rd place 1 season

Summary:
- You can aim for 3rd place with some blend of medium WR/medium participation; participation gets you into the fight, WR decides 3rd/4th/5th place
- You can't get 1st or 2nd without high participation, and once you have that, WR becomes the distinguishing factor between the two; whichever clan pushes harder (more participation) or achieves better results (higher WR) will win; the blend of both decides the winner
- Participation is the most important factor in CW
- 40-member cap clans (MB, Excel, NEETs, Python) can be competitive if they want to, but it takes more coordinated effort b/c everyone player counts

Conclusion:
- Having an older clan is an advantage ONLY as so far as it means you don't have to manage the roster as much as if you have a 40-cap clan
- It does absolutely nothing for participation & WR, that's still up to you
40+ Member Inactive Clan?: 6/27/2022 22:24:43

FiveSmith 
Level 54
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Actually Excel and Python are uncapped clans. So it means that only 2 of 9 clans above managed to become "most successful" while being 40-capped: MythBusters and NEETs.
(BTW, NEETs are recruiting! PM NEET King(https://www.warzone.com/Profile?p=5387863617))

UPDATE almost a month later: Sorry, was wrong, Excel is not uncapped (they do tricks to get 41 members), but Python is.

As what I have seen in NEETs, having that 40-cap is a major issue. NEETs had to undergo noticeable transformations in recruiting policy and in clan roster in order to raise total participation. It helped a lot, that NEETs was a mostly idle-focused clan originally, so CW (with their rewards and mechanics) are complementary for most of the players. Wonder what would have happened, if clan had non-idle focus.

It would be interesting to hear from someone at MB, what is their opinion on the cap and how much trouble that means for them. (Maybe get interviewed in the SDC podcast)

It does however make sense, that first you actually need players, who want to play CW. As of current season, there are only 6 clans, who have 20+ players participating in CW. But it also true, that getting higher absolute participation for any activity (not only CW) is WAY easier, when you are not limited by the total pool of players, which you have available.

Anyway "Don't listen to what people say, watch what they do". And we have recently seen a bunch of times (3-4), when people both new and from old clans make real effort to buy/obtain an uncapped clan. Pretty sure, we will see more of that.

Edited 7/19/2022 22:51:28
40+ Member Inactive Clan?: 7/18/2022 18:09:23


Dublin Warrior 
Level 56
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Replying to good points by King Neets, Krinid and FiveSmith about Clan Wars:

Q: are the older clans like M'Hunters opposed to expanding the Clan Member Limit?
40+ Member Inactive Clan?: 7/18/2022 18:12:55


Dublin Warrior 
Level 56
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Clearly Masters Clan doesn't bother with Clan Wars anymore, and I am not sure why, but I considered the possibility that winning the first 5 out of 6 seasons, and perhaps (not caring much about WZ Idle), led to some apathy?
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