<< Back to Warzone Idle Forum   Search

Posts 41 - 60 of 120   <<Prev   1  2  3  4  5  6  Next >>   
Artifacts guide 1.0: 4/29/2021 00:23:44

Phoenix
Level 25
Report
@krinid:
That's the whole point of the digging times. I forgot who asked for a score for dig sites that would effectively be "expected percentual value" by time and I forgot on which of the linked spreadsheet there was a listing of all encountered digging sites with their times. Iirc, the gist of it is, that all digging sites give you the exact same "value" per time (+/- a few percentage due to rounding). Hence, it doesn't surprise me how the numbers worked out.

So the outcome of every digging is the same value (per time unit). Or the other way: Each dig site's time is defined by their rarity distribution.

For the "value": each level of rarity is worth five times what the next lower rarity is worth. I guess we all assumed that but just to be clear here.

PS: the only variable is your luck with all the non-100%-common ones.

Edited 4/29/2021 00:24:25
Artifacts guide 1.0: 4/29/2021 02:00:31


asdfgh
Level 24
Report
FleXUS
IMO
Mine Boost
Army Camp Boost
Bonus Money Boost
Are the three that should be running all the time.

The 3 best swapping ones as needed:
Draft Boost
Item Values
either Mercenary Discount or Hospital Boost
I would have had Speedy Crafters over those 4, but it just got super nerfed. After the recent changes to Active Artifacts, one of those might be worth it, haven't really had the chance to experiment with them yet.
Artifacts guide 1.0: 4/29/2021 05:13:14


Parsifal
Level 63
Report
@Krinid, my ratio favors the uncommon (8:2), so I'd still take the chance and risk it. Because what is life without some fun?

@FleXUS, the only obviuos artifact to have during idle is Army Camp Boost.
the second slot can be Supercharge Army Camp, if you have it at least on epic (I never had it - can't tell)
if you have two more slots, then choose between Mine Boost, Bonus Money Boost and Territory Money Boost.
You need to always calculate what generates more money. In USA, for example, it was TMB that gave me the most....

for active time, there are no better artifacts - they are all good at what they do. If you need to sell alloys then speeding you crafters won't help you and vice versa.

I'd be careful and name a couple of artifacts you might use more frequently than the others:
Draft Boost, Hospital Boost, Army Camp Discount, Mercenary Discount, Army Cache Boost, Money Cache Boost, Item Value, Alloy Value.....
Artifacts guide 1.0: 4/29/2021 07:12:15


denna. 
Level 64
Report
@flexus

Continously epuipped artifacts: Army camp boost, bonus money boost, territory money boost (sometimes mine boost as alternative for the latter)

Swaps while active: Hospital boost, army cache boost, resource cache boost, merc discount/AC discount are also nice but less than the ones before.

Overall it really depends on how far you upgraded the specific artifacts and your playstyle, so there is no general rule
Artifacts guide 1.0: 4/29/2021 14:12:53


Master Jz 
Level 62
Report
I set a timer with Speedy Crafters equipped and it crafted the item at the unequipped time. It doesn't work at all right now. It might work if you leave it equipped for the full craft time without opening the game. I'm sending a bug report to Fizzer.

Edit: It has to be equipped from start to finish. If you're using the artifact, do not unequip it in the middle of a long craft. It's still in my top 3 for Idling artifacts, but it now essentially locks up a slot.

Edited 4/29/2021 14:38:24
Artifacts guide 1.0: 5/7/2021 12:50:34


Banxi 
Level 58
Report
FYI, used effectively, a top tier Hospital Boost Artifact can make the amount of troops saved by hospitals superior to the total amount of troops recruited (thats army camp+draft+army cache+mercs).

You won't need it on the first 11 maps. But on the later maps, after using SAC a few times, you should switch to it - at that moment you start pumping hospitals.

This gets even more effective with the 20% extra saved troops form tech. And once you unlock phase 4 it can get boosted even more.
Artifacts guide 1.0: 5/18/2021 19:24:25


awaythro 
Level 61
Report
I was thinking of making a top-level post but this seems like a good place for this.

### motive/context

There was a recent discussion in global chat about the relative merits of artifact digs, including a link to this fine spreadsheet:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1F5ejYV2bYeaP6yTH683A27iTY8ulDFxGXjwh0zXB82s/edit#gid=502188169

The figures presented in this spreadsheet suggest that the three poor-or-epic digs are inferior to the eight hour common dig in terms of expected epics per 1000 hours.

However, this is based on a presumption that the numbers displayed in the UI accurately represent the probabilities. If, on the other hand, these probabilities are rounded to the nearest percentage point, then the digs may be equivalent after all, depending upon the actual probabilities.

### dig metric

I will evaluate digs in units of "poors per hour", representing how many poor artifacts we expect per hour of digging at any given dig site. Non-poor artifacts are evaluated as such:

* 1 common = 5 poor
* 1 uncommon = 25 poor
* 1 rare = 125 poor
* 1 epic = 625 poor

### two examples

Let us first consider one popular dig, with an eight hour duration and a 100% chance of yielding a common artifact. We expect one common every eight hours, which converts to 5/8 = 0.625 poors per hour.

Next let us consider another example, with a 24 hour duration and a 50/50 chance of either a common or an uncommon artifact. Those 24 hour periods are each expected to yield an average of (0.5 * 5 + 0.5 * 25) = 15 poors, which scales to 0.625 poors per hour again.

### poor-or-epic digs

There are three known dig site classes which yield either poor or epic artifacts. The displayed times and probabilities are:

* 12 hours, 99% poor, 1% epic
* 22 hours, 98% poor, 2% epic
* 32 hours, 97% poor, 3% epic

If we assume these probabilities are accurate, then these digs turn out to be a little bit worse than the eight-hour 100%-common dig, specifically:

* 12 hour dig: (0.99 + 0.01 * 625) / 12 = ~0.6033 poors-per-hour
* 22 hour dig: (0.98 + 0.02 * 625) / 22 = ~0.6127 poors-per-hour
* 32 hour dig: (0.97 + 0.03 * 625) / 32 = ~0.6163 poors-per-hour

However, if these probabilities are simply the result of rounding to the nearest percentage point, then the digs may be equivalent. So which probabilities would make these digs equivalent?

Let's declare some variables:

* p_12 = probability of a poor in the 12-hour dig
* p_22 = probability of a poor in the 22-hour dig
* p_32 = probability of a poor in the 32-hour dig

In that case the three dig sites yield an expected:

* 12-hour: [p_12 + (1-p_12)*625] / 12 = (625 - 624*p_12) / 12 pph
* 22-hour: [p_12 + (1-p_12)*625] / 12 = (625 - 624*p_22) / 22 pph
* 32-hour: [p_12 + (1-p_12)*625] / 12 = (625 - 624*p_32) / 32 pph

If we set each of these equal to 0.625 and solve for p, we get:

* p_12 = (625 - 0.625 * 12) / 624 = ~98.9583%
* p_22 = (625 - 0.625 * 22) / 624 = ~97.9567%
* p_32 = (625 - 0.625 * 32) / 624 = ~96.9551%

Which are pretty close to the displayed values of 99%, 98%, and 97% respectively.

### conclusion

I don't know what the actual dig probabilities are, but if the displayed values are the subject of rounding, then it may very well be that all digs are equivalent in terms of expected poor-artifacts-per-hour units.
Artifacts guide 1.0: 5/18/2021 20:39:22


krinid 
Level 62
Report
Ignoring the rounding factor for now (since we don't know), I still place higher value over straight up 8 hour Common digs over 1%/2%/3% Poor/Epic digs because with the hundreds of Commons, you will get to choose which artifacts you want to upgrade up into Epics, whereas with 1-3 Epics you simply get whatever comes up and are either stuck with it or must use an Epic as fodder for Legendary.

Now, if you're ready foddering Epics are Legendaries, then you probably don't care much about this topic, and either way will be fine.

But if you're still deciding which Epics you want or waiting for that one special artifact to show up, or want to keep your options open, 8 hour Common digs are for you.
Artifacts guide 1.0: 5/18/2021 21:31:56


Master Jz 
Level 62
Report
I just made an update to the spreadsheet to show 5 decimals places instead of 2.

I believe the display values for uncommon/common split digs are exact, not rounded. If he were basing ratios off of dig length to make them all equal, then there should only be one ratio for 28 hours for the uncommon/common split. Instead, there are 4 different ratios.

For the rare and epic digs, only Fizzer knows for sure. For my spreadsheet, I assumed the values displayed were exact.
Artifacts guide 1.0: 5/18/2021 22:07:49


Banxi 
Level 58
Report
Here's another approach to quickly jump start a level

Burst approach (single level only)

Advancements
- Army camp production as high as possible (this will be the base formula for the burst start);
- Max joint strike;
- Max money cache;
- Max draft;
- Max army camp discounts;

Artifacts:
- Army camp boost;
- Money artifact (some levels are better with territory money, others with bonus money)
- Supercharge Army Camp (SAC);

Disable auto-upgrade army camps. You will upgrade Gislic only during SAC. It's output will be multiplied by 20. The +300% drafts will also be multiplyed because they are indexed to the army/sec. Money caches will be a huge source of income due to the sheer speed you pop them at the start. Smash it all on Gislic. Depending on active / passive play, Drafts can surpass Army camps production.

Edited 5/18/2021 22:18:30
Artifacts guide 1.0: 5/19/2021 22:36:36


Parsifal
Level 63
Report
@Master Jz, there is also the upgrade time you can calculate.
Getting one uncommon saves you 25*6 hours + 1*12 hours in compare to gathering poors, so in any case I'm more willing to take the risk of getting an common instead of uncommon than getting another poor instead of an Epic.

On the other hand I must admit that I rarely get the chance of deciding between digging sites.
In my case I usually have just one or two to pick from. So I just dig. At the later stages dig sites are starting to pile up, but then I just prefer finishing the level instead of digging all of them
Artifacts guide 1.0: 5/19/2021 22:57:45


Banxi 
Level 58
Report
Wouldn't it just be better to always go for the cheapest dig? Always be digging but pick the cheapest, or one of the cheapest ones.

Some dig sites are very expensive. The money you divert to digging isn't spent on hospitals, army camps or mercs. Thus, not picking the cheapest dig costs AP, because you take more time to finish the level.

From the spreadsheet, we can see the difference between dig sites isn't overwhelming. So going for one of the 2 or 3 cheapest one seems to have a better ROI, due to extra AP you get from finishing a level sooner.
Artifacts guide 1.0: 5/20/2021 01:45:24


Master Jz 
Level 62
Report
I go for digs that end at convenient times first, then cheap ones second. I leave half or more undug, usually.

Parsifal: I could put the information into the spreadsheet, but it doesn't affect my calculations. My numbers are based on infinite digs. Compared to infinite time, the 6+12+24+48 = 90 hours to convert 625 Poors into the last Epic at the end is negligible.
Artifacts guide 1.0: 5/20/2021 02:00:54


krinid 
Level 62
Report
@Banxi
If you're tight for money, then yes, go for the cheapest.

@Master Jz
Agree with you, I often go for the digs based on the dig end timing. If 8 hrs from now will be 2am, it's probably not a good time. Maybe go for 16-36 hrs to avoid wasted dig time.

Lately I've been playing ML a bit ... and I have much more flexibility on the digs, so target the "best dig" based on type (Common, Common/Uncommon, Everything else), time & money.
Artifacts guide 1.0: 5/25/2021 11:32:26


FunnyEric 
Level 63
Report
I have a question. Never used the "Field hospital" before. Now wanted to try but found no button to activate it and place it somewhere. Can anyone help?
Artifacts guide 1.0: 5/25/2021 12:21:09

Phoenix
Level 25
Report
Perhaps a dumb question but have you equipped the artifact? If so, on the "Artifacts/Advancements" tab there should appear a blue button below the Field Hospital (or any other active) artifact. This button won't appear in the "View All" dialog.
Artifacts guide 1.0: 5/25/2021 13:08:51


FunnyEric 
Level 63
Report
I did but didn't see an "activate" button which usually appears for such artifacts.
However, now it works. Maybe I was just sleeping ^^
Sorry for bothering and thanks for the answer!
Artifacts guide 1.0: 5/25/2021 19:25:03


Parsifal
Level 63
Report
Anyone has one or more of the following active artifacts:
Resource Cache, Triple Strike, Supercharge Army Camp and Supercharge Mine?

I'd like to have a screenshot of them.
I've rewritten the artifacts guide and added all the active artifacts, but I'm missing those 4 because I still haven't dug them.
https://justpaste.it/65zlb


Update: now I got them all. Thanks for the help mates!

Edited 5/26/2021 08:15:54
Artifacts guide 1.0: 5/26/2021 21:25:27


asdfgh
Level 24
Report
FunnyEric
The Activate Button appears on Tab with artifacts and AP store. It doesn't appear on the artifact widow that pops up. I guessing that was the problem you were having.

Edited 5/27/2021 02:31:38
Artifacts guide 1.0: 6/3/2021 15:34:46

Chief Rollie 
Level 60
Report
I'm still relatively new to idle but have some questions regarding the Time Warp artifact and haven't gotten one yet to test. The obvious benefits of using it are clear but I am considering the less obvious benefits of the artifact so any help would be appreciated.

1. Does using the Time Warp artifact reduce the dig time of a dig site in progress?

2. Does using the Time Warp artifact reduce the cooldown on other active artifacts?

3. Does using the Time Warp artifact reduce the cooldown on itself when used?

Assuming number 1 is true Time Warp could be the only free way to actually shorten how long it takes to acquire new artifacts. If number 2 is true it could be the foundation of active artifact usage. If number 3 is true Time Warp may be significantly better than previously understood as it's effective cooldown decreases with level.

Edited 6/3/2021 15:35:11
Posts 41 - 60 of 120   <<Prev   1  2  3  4  5  6  Next >>