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Siege: 8/18/2020 02:01:03

ps-ews
Level 59
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Fuck siege. This is a call to remove this awful template from Warzone completely. Why is it ranked so high on QM over MUCH BETTER templates? WTF? Siege is a scourge. Every time I play it I lose brain cells. It's the only template I've removed from my QM settings because it is SO AWFUL. I have had the privilege to never play that template in months. But its popularity pisses me off. So Siege haters, rise up and fight for the good skill and strategic templates of Warzone!
Siege: 8/18/2020 05:15:11


Timinator • apex 
Level 65
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LD Siege is cancer
Siege: 8/18/2020 10:22:29


Mars
Level 55
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LD Siege is cancer
Siege: 8/18/2020 11:53:14

JaiSh123
Level 58
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On the contrary, I strongly oppose. Infact, it is one of the templates I **haven't** removed.

It does lend itself to come interesting strategy. Infact, I feel your forum post is highly subjective. Please do give **valid** reasons why you dislike it so much. Even if you do, I see no reason to remove it, and if you don't like it, just dislike and move on.

Infact, if it's so popular, there must be a reason for that, right? ;-)

I feel it:
1)
__ a) Forces you to plan ahead. You should within a few moves, with the help of Reconnaisance cards, find out where the enemy is.
__ __ Then you quickly need to come up with a strategy to oppose them, and set up your supply chains in their direction.
__ b) Forces you to capture bonuses in a different way. You need to expand into a bonus with enough troops to take 2-3 territories
__ __ without any extra deployments. Take half the bonus, then the remaining half in the last turn.
2) Gives weaker players a chance to catch up. It takes some time to break through even a weak defence, and by that time, you should have moved up your reinforcements.
Example: https://www.warzone.com/MultiPlayer?GameID=22251759
Turn 6: Herm has 4+2 vs my 3. Yet I delay him long enough to complete my +7 and get it in play.
3) Prioritizes skill over numbers. Even if you have a numerical disadvantage, you can actually push back the other person and even break their defences, if you control your troops better than your opponent.
Example: https://www.warzone.com/MultiPlayer?GameID=23466610
When we meet, it is effectively 40 against 37. But, I already have a supply chain set up, while my opponent has no such chain. Therefore, I push him back, threaten his bonuses and win the game.
4) Makes you be decisive. You need to keep your five base bonus free for any unexpected circumstances. And you need to fight your enemy full on. Also, turn order matters a lot, so pay attention to it.
Example: https://www.warzone.com/MultiPlayer?GameID=21982037
Turn 7: I deploy all the extra armies attacking Herm, and even break his +7 bonus, winning the game.

Creating a forum post on **removing** it is highly illogical. You're delusional if you think everyone hates it, and those who don't will play it, nevermind what you think or feel.
Siege: 8/18/2020 12:49:18

ps-ews
Level 59
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LD Siege is cancer. Amen.

In response to this nonsense that purports that Siege is somehow "good":

1a. There is nothing here that implies "forcing you to plan ahead". For all strategic templates, you have to plan ahead. All I see here is that the process is made easier with your reconnaisance cards. (Which by the way have NO STRATEGY to them.) It is by pure lucky chance if you happen to guess where your opponent is because of stupid auto distribution they could be anywhere on the map.
1b. This is also nothing unique to Siege. Oftentimes you might want to take a 2 with 5 in many games in other templates so that you have 4 with standing army afterwards to take another territory with 3.
2. OK. Who cares.
3. "Prioritizes skill over numbers." What if... I know this is blasphemy... but what if it was possible to use skill to gain "numbers" AKA income? Yes I know. Mind blown. But of course, this is a foreign concept to Siege because it is auto distribution anyway.
4. "Turn order matters a lot." Hahaha. Have you ever played on REAL strategic templates? Turn order matters much more in real strategic templates than on Siege. But again, the points that you make are not unique to Siege. And Siege does an absolute wack job at providing any good strategy. It is just a cancer template.

Bottom line: Stop wasting your time with Siege and stick to real strategic templates.

Edited 8/18/2020 12:59:27
Siege: 8/18/2020 16:56:12


Timinator • apex 
Level 65
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I was forced to play LD Siege like once and it dragged to 50+ turns.
This shithole template takes way too long to finish off an opponent.
Siege: 8/18/2020 17:20:57


Phobos 
Level 62
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I've always suspected there may be some intricate strategy to mastering LD Siege, but the template is far too painful for me to care.

As for the OP, if you don't like a template just don't play it. Sure it might be holding a QM slot that could go to a better template, but clearly there are players that do enjoy playing it.
Siege: 8/19/2020 00:43:47


OvertForeigner 
Level 55
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idc whether siege is strategic or not. it's just not fun to play. it's painful
Siege: 8/19/2020 00:56:47


knyte 
Level 58
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I'm surprised strat players are okay with QM. QM has such a weird mix of cancer templates and hard-strat templates. Like you get SEAD, SE1W, then a bunch of cancer templates courtesy of Fizzer, then a bunch of overhyped cancer templates (RoR, IR, Siege, RoR but worse), and wham, Elitist Africa and Biomes, with Brawl soon to follow.

Now I see why so many newbies just stick with SEAD and SE1W. It seems like the strat players shrug and blame the cancer templates on newbies & casuals (how much voting power do they really have? I see some of these cancer templates have strat voters) but I don't see newbies & casuals being very enthusiastic about Siege either. Voters on the whole don't seem to represent either community that well imo, and I suspect there's some degenerate voting issues (vicious cycles promoting bad templates near the top, people voting for templates they haven't played on) in the mix.

Does QM's template system really make anyone happy? I'd guess it's rather good at disappointing everyone instead.
Siege: 8/20/2020 13:27:02

JaiSh123
Level 58
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Interesting. I would like to know if you find Europe 2v2 LD AD "strategic"? Europe 3v3?

Actually, what do you mean by "strategic" anyway? :-)
(BTW my games have never lasted >25 turns. And it's fun.)

Anyway, now that formalities are over, lemme respond.
1a) But YOU know where you want to expand. Just check if there is any enemy there.
No? Great! Free income.
Yes? Prepare for war. Simple.
1b) No. When you are fighting someone in non LD, you cannot afford to deploy anything other than the bare necessary to take a territory. Any extra would be a waste that you could have used to fight the enemy. Fight the enemy, then neutrals.
2) Who cares? WHO CARES? Let me show you a game.
Example: https://www.warzone.com/MultiPlayer?GameID=23613168
If this was not LD, we would have been steamrolled by Dark Blue.
3) This is obvious. We do that everywhere, and we do that here. No difference. Picking your bonuses is an integral part of every game.
4) Turn order matters a LOT here. If you break an important enemy bonus, you win. No bonus other than this one counts. But non LD, you can defend a +3 bonus using income of 5-10 bonuses. What is more strategic?
Defending a bonus of +3 using only 3? Or defending a bonus of 3 using 30?

Imagine if US could simply deploy their entire army at one base in the middle of the fight. Would it be strategic? But instead now you have to think about supply and logistics. Is this more strategic?

Edited 8/20/2020 13:28:48
Siege: 8/20/2020 13:37:09

[NL] Stan Smolders
Level 63
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In that game you shared dark blue was obviously the best there, but because of these terrible settings the other team still won. Dark blue deserved to win it.
Turn order matters a lot in EVERY strategic template lol, not more with LD.
I agree Siege LD is BY FAR THE WORST template on WZ, it's just painful to play, it's just clicking your chain of armies to the front and you end up stacking there. Also auto dist is not strategic, you really can't call an auto dist template strategic lol
Siege: 9/4/2020 13:25:20


MightySpeck (a Koala) 
Level 59
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IMO it’s cancer because of how long it would take to play a match of this. I can see it easily taking over a hour.

Unless someone (like I did) goes wow I don’t want to play this template anymore and surrenders way to early

Edited 9/4/2020 13:26:15
Siege: 9/4/2020 13:29:58


JK_3 
Level 60
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looks like LD Siege is either hated or loved, with no neutral opinions....

I think LD Siege is fun from time to time, but no more than 8 games a year on that template, and definitely as a MD game, since it takes way too long to play RT.
Siege: 9/4/2020 22:52:34

ps-ews
Level 59
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Wouldn't it last like a year on MD?
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