if you want drama there's mexican novels

"I want Outlaws banned from CL because they get butthurt over everything. "

What the absolute hell did we do to you?

If you're having an argument on the forum with one of our members, don't make this into a clan thing because it isn't. I and all the other Outlaws have done nothing to warrant being banned in clan league.

* @Krunx + Rento "I want Outlaws banned from CL because they get butthurt over everything." - What a ridiculously moronic statement followed by a paragraph of Krunx rage to being called an "attention whore", how dare you insult the whores. It's embarrassing and pathetic.

* @Tito You have to understand that it is not wrong for players to have concerns, telling players to fuck off isn't helping your case.

* @Cowboy The "they might collude" is more than enough of a valid point to justify a ruling, also the fact that it's taking a spot from another clan that has a unique identity.

* There is a distinct difference between two clans simply being friendly with each other than 101st/Lynx + Master's/Apps, one being natural and not going to be anything "deep" and one being part of the clan structures. It's a very big difference and to compare these relationships isn't correct.

*Onoma raises an interesting point, that issue never came up as there was the whole 101st/Lynx drama happened. So we never actually got to around to that issue, The split happened before the issue of 101st/Lynx being in the same division ever happened. I never stated an opinion on that matter cause I never needed to do it cause I felt confident Outlaws would get the spot but I was always against the 101st/Lynx being in same division in theory.

Edited 11/25/2018 00:02:38

@Styxie:

I think Rento was sarcastic, after some accusations about Lynx being a hivemind or something like that.

Edited 11/25/2018 00:12:51

Banning 101st from getting to A out of fear that they'll throw their games to lynx is silly. Just ban game-throwers if it becomes an issue.

Also voicing my support for the punishments made; I'd love to tell half my team what to pick every game but it doesn't measure a spread of slots that way. You'd just largely be testing the best player in each clan generally, which is pointless. It's a terrible clan mechanic to encourage (the dynamic that you can succeed more if you listen to X better/comparable player to assist with move ideas; creates pressure by some players to try to intervene vs many players fighting back against this dynamic; just wholly unhealthy in every regard) and really demeans the individual nature of the various games and turns them into games by committee.

Want it noted that I say this despite loving farah and wanting to play vs him in A :(

I despise the idea that a boot can cost a game/tournament/team etc. and I've come forward saying that if I had a teammate that was about to boot and I didn't have the vacations to stall for time to let them replace for AI, and I had their password, I'd 100% set a vacation for them. I think it would have been outrageous for punishment to be inflicted on max or zbd for the cl10 stuff and am glad nothing happened there, although I even wonder if warnings were necessary. The people that had game punishments levied against them did not just do that and fundamentally altered what is expected out of limited slots via providing additional advice/assistance in settings where it ought not be seen as appropriate and the team setting provided through cl competition.

Going forward, I don't think it's an unreasonable suggestion to have it such that players can submit their login info to the cl ethics committee or some other 3rd party through something like cryptobin prior to cl starting

https://cryptobin.co/f7y651s5

From there, they can say what the word to encode their cryptobin is to their teammates (they would not share the link if they did not wish to with their teammates; they'd just say the encoding word to teammates, and the link to the ethics committee/other reasonable third party). If a boot looks like it would be an issue, someone in the ethics committee can be given this password by a teammate and take a vacation -- should it be available -- for the player.

While I personally think the whole rigmarole of this is unnecessary and have no problems with what max/zbd did, I feel this solves just about every concern those who DO have issues with vacations during a tournament

Edited 11/25/2018 00:30:42

oh and the password to decode the crypto I pasted is weewoo

its not wrong to have concerns, its very wrong however to use concerns as a base for measures

i'm curious what the response to the anti-vacation set for teammate crowd says re: my suggestion, because I really think the only concerns are:

a. the pro-vacation crowd or the pro-security/privacy crowd might not feel it's necessary or may not want to feel pressured into sharing a password (there's no obligation to share/do this; it's merely an option should a player fear they may come into a situation where they may be booted)

b. there may be fears of who is responsible for monitoring these passwords doing something untoward (it doesn't have to be the ethics committee necessarily if there are members on it that are deemed problematic; just merely the concept is I think interesting. if the issue is in picking people, I think that's solvable. we got here through picking people, after all.)

c. there are worries about responsiveness or bias in responsiveness (not an issue if those held accountable for these links are trusted through various measures / held responsible to check something and respond over X period of time at risk of some punishment)

Edited 11/25/2018 00:36:50

It's an unfair assumption to make that people will collude because they have been structured very closely. If you think it's fair, I don't think outlaws should be in A because you would probably collude against lynx if you could.

"In my time with the clan, players in lynx offered to play for 101st. Our response was always no."

Tbh, that sounds really bad already...

Does anyone have any objections to Blitz and it's sister clan "Dragon Clan (For Blitz recruits and Dragons)" playing together in the qualifiers next season?

https://www.warzone.com/Clans/?ID=368

Well I'm sorry for being honest, but I can't control what people ask.

Why doesn't the Ethics Panel not review this issue and come up with a solution? I thought when I voted for this ethics panel, they would deal with these issues. At the moment, we do need a panel of 3/5 people to talk this issue in-depth in a non-biased way. It involves rules, so surely that brings in the ethics panel?

I personally don't want the ethics panel to review this one. Edge is very opinionated on this matter and I don't believe he would judge in an unbiased way.

This isn't even an issue tbh. It's just 3 or 4 people bringing it over and over.

You would also have Min too, so you either exclude them both or include them both for opinions and let the 3 neutral ethic panel people talk it out. I would definitely say it's an issue though that needs some type of judgment.

OR

You let the managers discuss and vote.

Edited 11/25/2018 01:39:21

I thank you for your honesty, but something is obviously very wrong if they are even offering to help you guys in such a manner.

Of course. This won't end up well regardless though. Ultimately, I think it would be better to find middle ground than just having them pick one side or another.

How is something obviously wrong? I'm not talking about AG, quicksilver or somebody similar. It's players who's skills are not A level, and would not be anything more than a puppet or sub. It's really no different than a player in an A clan playing in a different clan, because they don't make the cut. Only difference is we had a strict rule set to follow to be fair to other clans in the league.

Oh okay, people were talking about cheating, so I thought you meant lynx offered to play for 101st in cheatingful ways or something.

For those asking the ethics panel to rule on this, you're misunderstanding their entire purpose. It is to make judgements on whether existing rules have been broken, and how severe a punishment other to be. It is not to create new rules. That is TBest's job.