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Understanding our eastern fellow Europeans: 8/1/2018 11:44:15


{Canidae} Kretoma 
Level 58
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I have recently read articles like the following one:

https://europebetweeneastandwest.wordpress.com/2018/04/01/an-age-old-problem-hungarys-demographic-die-off/

and i was surprised. Could anyone from there enlighten me from their own perspective about the situation? I want to understand how does the societial hate against people like me orriginates there and what can we do to solve the problems you guys staying there are facing (good european neighbourhood, stronger together and the likes).

Edited 8/1/2018 11:44:43
Understanding our eastern fellow Europeans: 8/1/2018 12:10:19

Nemo
Level 62
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I dont see in the article anything about societial hate, not sure what you mean. I dont think there is any hate towards europeans, at least in my country. I would seriously question given reasons for population growth in Soviet times (looks like the author never lived in Soviet Union), but the rest seems to be pretty applicable to Baltic states as well.
Understanding our eastern fellow Europeans: 8/1/2018 13:04:01

Rento 
Level 60
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The first step towards understanding someone is abandoning both the sense of moral superiority and the harmful stereotypes about 'societal hate' and whatnot.
There's literally nothing said about hate in that article, but somehow people see it there regardless.
Understanding our eastern fellow Europeans: 8/1/2018 15:19:02


sound_of_silence
Level 56
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well i thought the decline of fertility rate (even including migrants) was a problem for western europe as well, so where is this societal hate concept come from

Edited 8/1/2018 15:19:47
Understanding our eastern fellow Europeans: 8/1/2018 15:31:11


حياة
Level 21
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i just really hate people like kretoma ye know?
Understanding our eastern fellow Europeans: 8/2/2018 00:35:02


Wulfhere
Level 48
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Bring back the DDR

made by nazbol gang
Understanding our eastern fellow Europeans: 8/2/2018 01:16:01


Dutch Desire
Level 59
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That article is mainly about Hungary, so the title is a bit odd.

Here's an article that shows a complete other picture on this topic:

Http://www.breitbart.com/london/2018/07/12/hungary-sees-rising-fertility-rate-turns-back-demographic-decline/amp/

Edited 8/2/2018 01:17:17
Understanding our eastern fellow Europeans: 8/2/2018 07:01:20


{Canidae} Kretoma 
Level 58
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I mainly used the article as an example. Of course i was talking about the majority of ex-communist countries.

What i mean are things like this:

https://www.sueddeutsche.de/politik/ungarn-in-ungarn-ist-alles-kaputt-1.3794823

https://www.huffingtonpost.de/2017/08/07/pis-magazin-polen-deutschen-hass_n_17695074.html

You see the normal people are not the issue here. We like each other. The problem are the governments.
(may i remind you Viktor Orbans "Migrant crisisis is not a European problem, it is a German problem!" - AFTER our government stood up to do something about people being stranded in HUNGARY after TURKEY and USA fucked up the Arabic world - AGAIN.)

By the way this is a population site based on UN data:
http://countrymeters.info/en/Hungary

Edited 8/2/2018 07:01:39
Understanding our eastern fellow Europeans: 8/2/2018 09:09:53


sound_of_silence
Level 56
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truly enlightening to see breitbart and huffington links provided on the same page, and turkey and usa being put to the same category, might as well include iran in the "fucked up arabic world" category lol, yeah right must be very unethical (pray tell who on earth cares about that) to do so, when saudi arabia and UAE have been doing the same with yemen ?! the arab world is deep in division and conflicts are bound to happen with or without foreign players meddling.

well most of these former communist country have a relatively fair election so these governments must have attain a considerable portion of support from its people, and you are saying that the "societal hate" towards western europeans (base on the PiS propaganda) are stem from the influx of western capitalism that causes them to lost work and income after the fall of USSR? then i guess it makes sense after all
Understanding our eastern fellow Europeans: 8/2/2018 09:42:17

Nemo
Level 62
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Ofc there is nostalgia to USSR, but its more for people who close themselves in memories and dont see the world. However, when I or my friends travel to Byelorussia, we feel so happy to be born to the west from the border and accepting western freedom instead of eastern total control. Even though freedom can not be separated from being free to choose (maybe not intentionally) poverty.
Understanding our eastern fellow Europeans: 8/2/2018 18:11:11


Norman 
Level 58
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You see the normal people are not the issue here. We like each other. The problem are the governments.
(may i remind you Viktor Orbans "Migrant crisisis is not a European problem, it is a German problem!" - AFTER our government stood up to do something about people being stranded in HUNGARY after TURKEY and USA fucked up the Arabic world - AGAIN.)


The goverments are elected by the people. And as Rento said, the real question you are trying to find an answer for is more like that you want to "understand how our eastern fellow Europeans are so wrong." If you truly want to find an answer I'd like to point you in the direction of trucks speeding through pedestrians.

Edited 8/2/2018 18:14:45
Understanding our eastern fellow Europeans: 8/2/2018 19:00:27


{Canidae} Kretoma 
Level 58
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It seems this goes in the wrong direction. Iwas not trying to paternise anyone i respect your opinions. I just want to understand the reasoning of focosing that strong on a topic, that is not really that important right now. It will become an issue, but closed borders for foreigners will in fact speed up the crisis (pressure cooker effect) and rob us of the time to adress the core problems humanity has:

- use of non- or really slow renewable ressources
- a way to high number of humans on the planet right now, getting worse every second
- destruction of renewable ressources (by poisining of the environment, loss of biodiverity, overuse, etc.)
- degradation of the human gene pool

So what is the stand of i.e. Orban supporters on those issues (and please no talk about cutting dows immigration, that is the only one i could agree on, but the effect on population growth is not clear for me, more or less people with it?)
Understanding our eastern fellow Europeans: 8/2/2018 21:26:07


Dutch Desire
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closed borders for foreigners will in fact speed up the crisis (pressure cooker effect) and rob us of the time to adress the core problems humanity has.

Why and how does closing the border speed up the crisis?

Edited 8/2/2018 21:26:36
Understanding our eastern fellow Europeans: 8/3/2018 00:32:54


sound_of_silence
Level 56
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well now i understand this was meant to be a Viktor Orban centric post eh ...
Understanding our eastern fellow Europeans: 8/3/2018 04:08:36


Wulfhere
Level 48
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>addressing the "core problems of humanity"
yeah, tribal warfare and racial conflict is a huge conflict that would be addressed with a sane immigration policy

So the Left will admit that there's a world crisis (i.e. climate change, corporatism, totalitarian government) but they think these things can be solved with MORE TRIBAL CONFLICT
Understanding our eastern fellow Europeans: 8/6/2018 01:49:40

The Furious Logan
Level 27
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dude you are a tribe
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