" Now why is it so easy to use the Bible to promote slavery, and murder of jews and homosexuals?
The answer is quite simple, it is because you can find mutliple passages in the Bible promoting just that. "


You do realize a lot of atheist stopped using this argument when they found out that a lot of those passages were being taken out of context or they were from the OT which was jewish and had at the time had a different culture?


and for the love of everything holy I am not abandoning the OT! I am just saying it is not as relevant then the NT


And what exactly is there in atheism that says its wrong to enslave others? according to atheism, if there is no god then there is no after life to fear or look forward too, and thus there is no punishment for what you do in this life. So there is no such thing as right or wrong, just what you think feels good or what you want to do because there is nothing to fear and no punishment for what you do to others. So if there is no right or wrong then what is the point? The only right without religion is what you think is right and what you think is evil. So Ted down the street could think its perfectly right and just to rape his cousin. And since there is no official right or wrong, what is the cousin going to do? all she has is what she thinks is wrong and at the moment, that aint gonna do her much good.


Our entire society is based off of what religion says is honorable, Right, or wrong. The world has accepted these things and it is not even considered part of religion anymore, just common sense. So you can sit there and tell me religion is no good, but this world with pure atheism would be pretty heartless and cold

Edited 2/3/2016 21:42:36

You do realize a lot of atheist stopped using this argument when they found out that a lot of those passages were being taken out of context or they were from the OT which was jewish and had at the time had a different culture?

Nope, i don't realize that because it is false for one, we can go over the morally wicked passages of the Bible and discuss the context and its relevance if you want, but i'm definitely quite convinced that a lot of passages in the Bible are moraly unjustifiable whatever the context. (Justifiable for dark ages morals sure, but not by an omnibenevolent God's morals)

according to atheism, if there is no god then there is no after life to fear or look forward too, and thus there is no punishment for what you do in this life. So there is no such thing as right or wrong, just what you think feels good or what you want to do because there is nothing to fear and no punishment for what you do to others

Oh wow, you went there. Atheism represent the disbelief in any deities (and more narrowly, the belief that there is no deity). Thats it. There is no ideology tied to atheism.

The thing is, i try to do good because i have my own set of morals, that are based on reason and education. I don't do good because i fear punishement, no. If fact, if the only reason you do good is because you are afraid of punishement, then you are not really a good person.

edit: lol i can't believe you are using Phil Robertson's arguments.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6jvKi221I4Q

Edited 2/3/2016 22:09:17

Our entire society is based off of what religion says is honorable, Right, or wrong. The world has accepted these things and it is not even considered part of religion anymore, just common sense. So you can sit there and tell me religion is no good, but this world with pure atheism would be pretty heartless and cold

I wholeheartedly disagree with everything in that statement


edit:
Please watch this debate between Sam Harris and William Lane Craig, on the foundation of morality
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yqaHXKLRKzg

If you are not convinced that the argument of morality from God is wrong after this, there is nothing i can ever say that will make you change your mind.

Edited 2/3/2016 22:40:47

Ok then, Your basically saying that morality is just something that is recognized by all 4 billion people on this planet as generally the right thing to do and it all started with a cave man who decided one day not to steal from his friend and then it just progressed to the point where it affected everything? no motives, nothing.....



Wow, that's almost as stupid as the idea that we all came from apes....

Or that a big explosion in space created us all.....

or that babys go through a process of turning into a donkey, ape, horse before becoming human inside the mother

.....Yes, this all seems logical



Here is why I will never accept evolution.


If I stick a whale inside a room and leave him there with enough food to last and females to create offspring and then leave for a million years or so.....Evolution says when I come back I will probably find a cow......

And people say Creationists are nuts....

Edited 2/3/2016 22:14:28

Hitch, Morality cannot just randomly form in a persons mind with no motive or origin and then spread through generations and reach around 4 billion people



Something cannot come from nothing

Your basically saying that morality is just something that is recognized by all 4 billion people on this planet as generally the right thing to do

You might wanna check how many people there is on this planet. And saying that they all agree on what is right and what is wrong is factually wrong in every way. There is probably not 2 people on this planet that can agree 100% on what is right and what is wrong.

and it all started with a cave man who decided one day not to steal from his friend and then it just progressed to the point where it affected everything? no motives, nothing.....

haha whaaaaaaaaat?

Wow, that's almost as stupid as the idea that we all came from apes....

Or that a big explosion in space created us all.....

or that babys go through a process of turning into a donkey, ape, horse before becoming human inside the mother

.....Yes, this all seems logical



Here is why I will never accept evolution.


If I stick a whale inside a room and leave him there with enough food to last and females to create offspring.....Evolution says when I come back I will probably find a cow......

lol i don't know who's coolaid you have been drinking, but your policy to learn about things before criticizing it sure went away quickly

Litteraly every statement you wrote is inaccurate.

And people say Creationists are nuts....

You can't begin to realize the irony in that statement, after what you've just said

Lol I just described much of the basis of evolution and you just told me I was wrong.....ok I guess your a special kind of stupid ;)


anyway this is not the point of the thread and it probably has served its purpose

Morality cannot just randomly form in a persons mind with no motive or origin and then spread through generations and reach around 4 billion people

I agree. Does it mean God is the origin of morality? of course not, there is no logical connection between the 2 statements.

Something cannot come from nothing

So God can't come from nothing? Who created God then? Let me guess...this statement is true for everything BUT God?

btw, read A Universe From Nothing from Lawrence Krauss, it could change your perspective on what is nothing

Lol I just described much of the basis of evolution and you just told me I was wrong.....ok I guess your a special kind of stupid ;)

Nope, you've just described what ignorant creationists believe to be true about evolution. Not surprisingly, everything you described is wrong.

edit: I strongly encourage you to look up every statement you made, and cross examine them with what scientific papers actually say. If the reason you don't believe in evolution is because you think that the theory of evolution is what you described, then i strongly suggest you to actually inquire about what really is the Theory of Evolution. Because i agree,*IF* all of your statements about evolution were true, then yes the theory of evolution really is incredibly stupid

Edited 2/3/2016 23:04:09

If you stick a small population of things somewhere and wait for a long time, then yes, you will find a new group of things that are well-adapted to the environment.

If you stick a small population of things somewhere and wait for a long time, then yes, you will find a new group of things that are well-adapted to the environment.

No, almost there but still wrong. However large a population of human, if you put them naked on Mars, i doubt you'll come back to a well adapted population ^^

edit: unless we consider the bacteria human would have bring with them, probably a few of them would have adapted well :)

Edited 2/3/2016 22:52:21

I meant somewhere habitable. I doubt either me or Conservative meant some hellhole.

i know, but you don't have to go to Mars to find inhabitable places for certain species. The whole concept of natural selection is about the ability to adapt to the environment. If a specie can't adapt, it dies out. Happened many times on earth through history

edit: and Conservative wasn't talking about neither of what we said.

Edited 2/3/2016 23:00:38

Like I said, this conversation isn't going anywhere.

Stop spreading cancer hitchslap.

Like I said, this conversation isn't going anywhere.

Well i wouldn't say that. We have now a much better understanding of what each of us think, and we now have some new ideas to think about and scrutinize. As for everyone reading the conversation

But in the end you are just plain

Does anyone here actually have work to do in real life...how can hitchslap, wct, and a couple others account for over 50% of this thread??

i'm mostly here at night, i don't sleep much, but i work during the day.
And coming from you Jai, It's the pot calling the kettle black xD

I literally don't respond to off-topic debates anymore...they're too time consuming.


Plus I don't even touch WL for most of the afternoon during classes.