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Tutorial : how to write a map review: 10/25/2015 13:54:03


Belgian Gentleman 
Level 56
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It's long ago we've heard of Nathan, the beloved map reviewer.
https://www.warlight.net/Profile?p=3717129668

Since then and since now he has not given map reviews anymore.
Will he be back or is he gone forever? No one really knows but Nathan himself.

News maps are getting published but without Nathan, map reviews are not so much presented at all.
No reviews means no feedback. Could this lead to a dying map-development community?

Anyway. We as a community really should be able to help each other and give them the constructive critic and feedback they needed. And we will always do this.

That's why I call you up to stand for youself and not to be shy to give a review on someone's map.
We really need you support!

In this thread you can find a tutorial on how you write a correct, constructive and efficient map review. This is posted by no other than the great gentleman himself.




Tutorial: How do I write a constructive map review?

First we have to pick a map on which we will give a review. For this I have decided to take the Millennium Mediterrean Diplomacy created by MrOobling. This map has currently only 4 ratings and no map reviews. Quite sad for such a big map.



Step 1: Give a compliment.

Awesome map ! This is comparable with the European Nations map but just bigger.


Step 2: Tell the map maker what positive points the map has and what it can offer.

It works great for roleplay and diplomacy games. Armies are rewarded by single-territories and not by regions. I see you have taken your Meditterean map and modified it into an acceptable diplomacy map and


Step 3: Tell if you enjoyed it or not.

I honestly like it!


Step 4: Give a formal insult. Tell him what can be better or explain the negative points.

Although I dislike those silly dislocated circles. They're like everywhere around. Also considering the names of some circles like 'Paris', 'Bavaria' and 'Persia' even though the real-life geographical locations are not to find on the map.


Step 5: If it has negative points , tell the mapmaker how he can improve it.

You could do me a favor by erasing those circles. They don't seem to serve an important purpose and are annoying my way.


Step 6: Compliment again.

But besides it's a pretty map. Good work!


Also don't forget to give the map a rating that's based upon your reasoning.


There you have it!


If you find a map perfect with no true complaints then can skip over step 4 and 5 and rate it a 5!

So this was my tutorial. If you have any thoughts then please comment on this thread. This thread is made on purpose to motivate people to review. Now you have read all of this, it's your turn! Go to a map , give it feedback based on your opinion and rate it.

Don't be shy! Just do it! Nothing is impossible.



Edited 10/25/2015 13:59:05
Tutorial : how to write a map review: 10/25/2015 14:05:54


OnlyThePie
Level 53
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Nice job Belgian. You're right, we need more reviewers. Also, did you know Shia got arrested for shouting that at people in public while he was drunk?
Tutorial : how to write a map review: 10/25/2015 14:21:14


Belgian Gentleman 
Level 56
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Thank you for your support. No I didn't know that. Thank you for the interesting fact. It's not uncommon for him. He has been arrested a lot of times. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shia_LaBeouf#Legal_troubles_and_controversy
Tutorial : how to write a map review: 10/26/2015 03:06:12


Dublin Warrior 
Level 49
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I like checking out new maps,
and adding them to my favorites list so that they are easy to call up when I want to play a game.

I wish I could give feedback on the map pages for maps that I haven't played yet.

There is a lot I can tell about a map even before I have played it.

I guess that would encourage trolling... oh well.
Tutorial : how to write a map review: 10/26/2015 03:48:34


Жұқтыру
Level 55
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Do not give underserved compliments.

And also, a 3/5 is something to be proud of; 4/5, that applies maybe for your top 5 maps; and 5/5 is oh my gosh, was this map made by god? I'm going to stalk this mapmaker since this map was so good.

DO NOT OVERATE!

I think there's something like 5 maps in Warlight below 2/5 (ok)? Really? There are more maps that are undeniably bad, but 5 out of 1100? Come on.

Edited 10/26/2015 03:48:48
Tutorial : how to write a map review: 10/26/2015 04:22:25

M. Poireau
Level 55
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+1; couldn't agree more.

3/5 is a "Good" rating.
Tutorial : how to write a map review: 10/26/2015 06:31:12


Dr. Stupid 
Level 58
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I don't have the energy to dig it up, but Nathan is still around quite recently. NinjaNic's newest map (I think it's called "a certain geographic area") was published less than two weeks ago and it has a Nathan review attached to it.
Tutorial : how to write a map review: 10/26/2015 10:41:50


Imperator
Level 53
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DO NOT OVERATE!

I think there's something like 5 maps in Warlight below 2/5 (ok)? Really? There are more maps that are undeniably bad, but 5 out of 1100? Come on.


In my opinion, you can give a map a three or four if there's no problem with it, but you didn't particularly enjoy it, and a 5 if you did enjoy it and have no problems with it. I never give out 2's but if there's a really terrible map I'll give it one.

The only thing is, if you're going to be giving out 1's, you'd better leave a review, because even making a terrible map takes a lot of work, and to have that rated 1 star is pretty
disheartening.

Look, all i'm saying is, don't refuse to give a map 5 stars just because it's not "made by God". If you have a map that someone worked hard on, and you don't have any problem with it, and you really enjoyed the map, give that person five stars, because that is LITERALLY the definition of a perfect map.

And btw, thanks BG, you inspired me to go review all 11 maps that don't have an average rating yet.

Edited 10/26/2015 10:54:09
Tutorial : how to write a map review: 10/26/2015 15:12:08


Zephyrum 
Level 60
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Reasons why I don't do that is because I have to actually do it from a game's end screen. And for that I have to play a whole game to rate/review the map.

NOPE NOPE NOPE NOPE NOPE.
Tutorial : how to write a map review: 10/26/2015 16:54:44


Olkani [PG] 
Level 62
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Without Nathan, it would be really boring ;-)

I would also write some reviews but my English is too bad

Edited 10/26/2015 16:58:04
Tutorial : how to write a map review: 10/26/2015 18:40:29


MrOobling
Level 30
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Aww, you used my map as an example. I agree with your advice- your rating was very helpful and I was sceptical about the out of map regions so I have severely reduced outside circles. More people should review maps- it is helpful for both the map maker and players of the map. It's kind of sad that my other recent map (Blood Moon) hasn't even got 10 ratings after 3 weeks. Although I am being hypocritical by saying this as I never review maps but what Zephyrum pointed out is too true.
Tutorial : how to write a map review: 10/26/2015 18:55:10

An abandoned account
Level 56
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I normally go by:
1=an unplayable map
2=a terrible map, but still playable
3=an okay map, but nothing special
4=a good map
5=an exceptionable map
Tutorial : how to write a map review: 10/26/2015 19:10:02


TBest 
Level 60
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^

With the current number of maps a 1 - 10 scale would have been nice.

Edited 10/26/2015 19:11:11
Tutorial : how to write a map review: 10/26/2015 19:26:03


skunk940 
Level 58
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GG
Tutorial : how to write a map review: 10/26/2015 22:12:14


Benjamin628 
Level 59
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80% of the total reviews and rates are from 20% of the players.
80% of the total rates and reviews are on 20% of maps.
80% of the total maps are made by 20% of the map makers.
80% of the total average rating sum is held by 20% of the maps.
80% of the total territories are held by 20% of the maps.
80% of the total server space (for maps) is used by 20% of the maps.
80% of the games played are on 20% of the maps.
---------------------------------------------------------------
Sorry, but I think the problem is not with the amount of people rating it. The maps with the best rating are at the top, causing people to play them more, and rate them good more because they think if other people like it they must, and are more inclined to rate it a 5.

https://www.warlight.net/Play?PreviewMap=10895

This map is disgustingly ugly, yet people love it, including me. Why? It was one of the first maps in the game. The nearly-unanimously accepted (By top players) as the best 3v3 template is on that map.

Duel, on the other hand, is the worst map in the game.

You cannot beat the 80/20 bias, and it is shown evidently in the distribution of whatever in maps.
Tutorial : how to write a map review: 10/26/2015 23:41:01


Mudderducker 
Level 57
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1. Terrible, how did you make this so bad...
2. Getting better, but still bad...
3. Ok/good, but nothing special...
4. Good/great now we are getting somewhere...
5. Special, only the best, hardly rated any 5/5

It should be increased to 10/10, but I don't see how this could be changed?. The minimum votes needed should also be increased to 50, to help stop overrated maps.
Tutorial : how to write a map review: 10/27/2015 01:04:54


Ranek
Level 55
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Belgian Gentleman, I really appreciate your attempts to appeal the community on making nice reviews. Unfortunately, you forgot a crucial thing about the review. they are not only used for the creator to help them with some map issues or to improve the map. This part is more related to the testing stage within this forum. In my opinion a good review introduces the map to an uncertain audience, which has never played the map before. additional informations could be about the game youve played and if it was fun or not. for which kind of games you recommend the map for (somehow, you did so, but you always adressed your review towards the creator, which gives the whole review a different purpose.). and best would be a recommendation of cards or even a template.


OFFTOPIC:


https://www.warlight.net/Play?PreviewMap=10895

This map is disgustingly ugly, yet people love it, including me. Why? It was one of the first maps in the game. The nearly-unanimously accepted (By top players) as the best 3v3 template is on that map.


Totally agree. but this map is more like an exception from the rule. It is one of the first maps. The map standard was very low these days and fortunately it evolved/increased. Troll made some things perfectly right. It is a great map for competitive games with medium size. and there was a time, where the number of players was limited to six, when you had no membership. Furthermore there havent been just about 100 alternative europe maps like nowdays. so maybe the rating was well deserved but is outdated. I realized, how bad it was made, after I made my own maps.

anyways, Im unsure what you try to imply. it is true, most maps are rated when they are new or when they are already famous and at least appear among the top 100.

Reasons why I don't do that is because I have to actually do it from a game's end screen. And for that I have to play a whole game to rate/review the map.


No, you can always start a single player game and surrender first turn and write a review right afterwards. which is nearly no effort.
Tutorial : how to write a map review: 10/27/2015 03:16:58


Жұқтыру
Level 55
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In my opinion, you can give a map a three or four if there's no problem with it, but you didn't particularly enjoy it, and a 5 if you did enjoy it and have no problems with it. I never give out 2's but if there's a really terrible map I'll give it one.

The only thing is, if you're going to be giving out 1's, you'd better leave a review, because even making a terrible map takes a lot of work, and to have that rated 1 star is pretty disheartening.

Look, all i'm saying is, don't refuse to give a map 5 stars just because it's not "made by God". If you have a map that someone worked hard on, and you don't have any problem with it, and you really enjoyed the map, give that person five stars, because that is LITERALLY the definition of a perfect map.


What're you doing? There's already an unified code already, written by Fizzer. There are various interpretations of it, since it's a very short legend, though. Word-for-word:

1: Would not recommend.
2: Okay.
3: Good.
4: Great!
5. Perfect!

There's various interpretations since it's so short; I like Apollo's.

1. Terrible, how did you make this so bad...
2. Getting better, but still bad...
3. Ok/good, but nothing special...
4. Good/great now we are getting somewhere...
5. Special, only the best, hardly rated any 5/5


Here is what I think of it.

1: Clearly few effort was put in. Just a bad map that you think Warlight should remove to stop cluttering the maps (what, now ~1150 maps?)
2: Can't say anything much bad about it, it has good ideas and good bits, but still needs some improvement. Still a time waste to play it, but not so much.
3: I like to play it. It's good, there are no big problems, though there might be several small ones, but it's a good enough map.
4: Wow, this is a really fun map. The mapmaker has some skills, I'll see what other maps he's made. It has very few minor problems (maybe wrong territory names), it's quite enjoyable.
5: Wow, this I can not say anything about. Infallible map, it's everything that I wanted. I can't really wish for more nor suggest anything. This needs to win the map of the year. Very rare.

5 I agree, if you enjoy it and have nothing to suggest at all, no problems, either, 5. But don't give a 5/5 rating and then list some problems in your text rating. 2 is for maps that do have hope, that can get better and already do have good spots.
Tutorial : how to write a map review: 10/27/2015 10:45:28


Imperator
Level 53
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That's what I'm saying. You don''t have to be like "this needs to win map of the year" or "this map was made by God" to give out five star ratings. Seriously, what sense does it make to only give out one of them per year? :D

For that matter, there's not any reason to only give 6 maps a year Ratings above 3 stars, as you seem to be of the opinion("4/5, that applies maybe for your top 5 maps"/"5/5 is oh my gosh, was this map made by god?").

If a map A:looks really good, B:Does not have any missing connections, and C:is pretty enjoyable to play, then I don't understand what the problem is with giving it five stars. And IMO there is definitely more than one of these released per year, and honestly there are probably more than 6.
Tutorial : how to write a map review: 10/27/2015 10:54:04


Luna {TJC}
Level 56
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Thanks for the guide Belgian gentleman really make reviewing easier.
Tutorial : how to write a map review: 10/27/2015 12:12:29


pereira325
Level 58
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I don't write map reviews, but I agree with Imperator.
A five out of five does not have to mean no flaws at all. But very very few at all.
What Fizzer gave as his instructions for rating in 1-5 seems pretty easy to understand but you guys are rating everything harsher than he wants.
A 4 is NOT (my opinion) an okay map. It is a good map! This means you can play it and enjoy it.. it still is missing a few things that make it not a 5.
A 3 is an OK map which probably means it isn't great. It still can be played but it's not going to be very fun..
A 1 is complete junk which should be deleted.
Tutorial : how to write a map review: 10/27/2015 14:10:30


Ranek
Level 55
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good ratings also encourage the creator to work on make similar maps. It is good to know if the community is appreciating your work, because maps did take a lot of time to get done.
Anyways, I second Imperators execution on the subject. there is no need to be thrifty with five and four stars, because most of the time the rating depends on opinion, which means someone will like and give it a good rating someone will not and give it a bad rating. at the end it will be an average value. no map will ever achieve 5 stars in average rating. better consider if the current average fits with your opinion.
Tutorial : how to write a map review: 10/27/2015 16:36:21

Captain Weasel
Level 26
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Also agreed with Imperator. By the reasoning of some other players, no map deserves 5 stars because none of them are perfect.

For example, 2 top maps: Rise of Rome has gotten a 5/5 rating by probably half of the people rating it. I can't say they are all wrong just because the map is offset to the right, Partha is a bit overpowered, there are no custom distribution modes... Or Troll's Europe: actually has pretty messy borders up close, some eastern territories are stuck against the edge of the screen, and the bonuses are not even that balanced (Spain is easier to control than France and has 1 territory less but both are worth 6). Still, people consider these maps exceptionally good and give them 5/5. It doesn't matter what criteria they use for this, this will be different for different people and in the end comes down to taste. There really are no objective criteria. Two different people will comment with blunt confidence that your map is bad for this or this reason, and contradict eachother.

Edited 10/27/2015 16:45:50
Tutorial : how to write a map review: 10/27/2015 16:48:41


Lolicon love
Level 56
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we shall use the IGN rating system
1-7.8 means it's horrible
7.9 is meh
8- 10 means it's paid off and utterly horrible.
Tutorial : how to write a map review: 10/27/2015 18:33:07


Belgian Gentleman 
Level 56
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Ranek has a point, my reviews are mostly adressed towards the map creator rather than the people interessed in the map. Maybe I should less concern about the map creator in my responses and evade phrases like ' The map creator did a good job at this'?

It's a good thing which I should apply in my next reviews. Thanks for your remark. I didn't even figured it out by myself.
Tutorial : how to write a map review: 10/27/2015 18:55:00


Luna {TJC}
Level 56
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Obviously everyone know partha is stronger but why? Less chock points and pure land to tear though?
Tutorial : how to write a map review: 10/27/2015 20:05:45

M. Poireau
Level 55
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The advantage of being "stingy" with your 4's and 5's is that you use the full range of the 1-5 scale.

If everyone is giving out 5's to maps they like and 3's and 4's to maps they don't like as much, you're only using half of the scale.

The more people use the full scale for ratings, the more useful ratings are to the community. It's better for everyone.
Tutorial : how to write a map review: 10/27/2015 20:59:55


MrOobling
Level 30
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I disagree with Raneks comment. From the test games I have played, I have found most people don't actually give feedback with most feedback being on minor things such as territory names, connections and bonus values. There is still the problem of people surrendering or being booted early in the game making the balance vary and other times, people give comments too radical and unrealistic. Yes you should give recommendations to players but you should also give tips to the mapmakers.
Tutorial : how to write a map review: 10/27/2015 23:30:23


Жұқтыру
Level 55
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What Fizzer gave as his instructions for rating in 1-5 seems pretty easy to understand but you guys are rating everything harsher than he wants.

A 3 is an OK map which probably means it isn't great. It still can be played but it's not going to be very fun..


I really don't get what you're doing. We're being as strict as Fizzer wants. 3 is Good, 2 is OK, as Fizzer himself says.
Tutorial : how to write a map review: 10/27/2015 23:42:41

E Masterpierround
Level 56
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I really don't get what you're doing. We're being as strict as Fizzer wants. 3 is Good, 2 is OK, as Fizzer himself says.


So do we have different definitions of "OK" and "Good"? To me, if you're going to be using the full scale, it should be like this:

1 - Contending for worst map in existence
2 - Bad map
3 - OK map. It is at least playable.
4 - Good map. This is where most maps that took actual effort to create should go.
5 - Outstanding map. The kind you create multiple templates for because you think it's so good.

If 2 is "OK", then do you not differentiate between maps that are "bad" and maps that "should be deleted"?

Edited 10/27/2015 23:44:45
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