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Where are my leftists at?: 6/27/2015 07:01:30


knyte 
Level 58
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There seems to be a rather high level of political discussion (at least higher than I'd expect in an online website where people play Risk) in these forums, and it's not too hard to find someone from the extreme right (i.e., fascism) here.

I'm wondering if that's true for the left. Where at my socialists (i.e., people who advocate in some way, shape, or form for worker control of the means of production) at? How about leftists in general- including social democrats and other liberals?

Maybe if there's enough of us we can track the fascists/sexists/racists/imperialists in a shared open blacklist. :D
Where are my leftists at?: 6/27/2015 10:36:36


OxTheAutist 
Level 58
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Me :D. From my knowledge, I've also heard that Panda and Juq are left. Juq being centre-left, and Panda being further left.
Where are my leftists at?: 6/27/2015 10:42:14


shyb
Level 59
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i consider myself far left. i don't really want to blacklist anyone for their views. i just wish they would quiet down about it, cause i don't need political education from anyone.
Where are my leftists at?: 6/27/2015 10:51:16


knyte 
Level 58
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I'm just tired of racists cluttering in-game chats and screaming that Africans are "knuckle-dragging half-apes" (a RT diplo from today).
Where are my leftists at?: 6/27/2015 15:22:45


Eklipse
Level 57
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I don't really place well on the usual political spectrum. Although I guess you could say Im half leftist because I'm liberal on economic issues.
Where are my leftists at?: 6/27/2015 15:59:04


knyte 
Level 58
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Liberal in the sense that you want more government control? Government-controlled economy + social conservatism is generally right-wing.
Where are my leftists at?: 6/27/2015 16:07:51


Fallen Angel
Level 55
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I refuse to define myself as strictly 'left', or 'right', or anything else for that matter. To align myself completely with an ideology would be more of a hindrance than a help: I choose to debate each political/sociological problem individually, instead of following the herd of sheep.

That said, I do, generally, seem to agree more with those who call themselves left.
Where are my leftists at?: 6/27/2015 16:15:08


TBest 
Level 60
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What is left and right depends from country to country. I mean all of US is to the right of Norway. So the average 'right' person in Norway probably would be a Democrat. I recommend to avoid using 'right' and 'left' on the internet, to avoid confusion.

Also as Fallen Angel said. "I choose to debate each political/sociological problem individually, instead of following the herd of sheep.

That said, I do, generally, seem to agree more with those who call themselves left."
Where are my leftists at?: 6/27/2015 16:19:58


Eklipse
Level 57
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When I say economically liberal I mean that I embrace labor unions, working class benefits, socialist policies, etc.

Perhaps my terminology was off.
Where are my leftists at?: 6/27/2015 16:23:26


knyte 
Level 58
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Ah no, your terminology wasn't off. I just get confused when people use the word "liberal" since it could mean many things.

When I use the term "left," I specifically refer to people who oppose capitalism on some level.

Also using the term "left" since socialists/communists tend to generally identify ourselves as "The Left" or "radical leftists."

Edited 6/27/2015 16:24:17
Where are my leftists at?: 6/27/2015 17:37:55


[Wolf] {F} Kellen the Conquerer
Level 51
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I am middle but EXTREMELY SLIGHT left.



*Edit* Funny because I identify myself as a Republican

Edited 6/27/2015 17:38:27
Where are my leftists at?: 6/27/2015 19:13:56


knyte 
Level 58
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I don't want to do any gatekeeping, but I was looking for... like, actual leftists. Not centrist liberals who misappropriate the label "leftist" in a bid to hide their marginzalization of anti-capitalist ideology. Social democrats, sure. Actual socialists, hell yeah.

Basically, if you are:

- anti-imperialist
- anti-fascist
- anti-capitalist
- opposed to all forms of structural oppression
- sympathetic to the idea of worker control of the means of production

you are who I'm trying to find.
Where are my leftists at?: 6/27/2015 19:16:40


Red
Level 32
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<- Socialist
Where are my leftists at?: 6/27/2015 19:16:43


Nex
Level 60
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but I was looking for... like, actual leftists.


Sorry, I'm ambidextrous
Where are my leftists at?: 6/27/2015 20:32:04


Imperator
Level 53
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Like some people said, It depends on your country. Basically all americans are centrists, centre-right or centre-left respectively.

I think that socialism is a great concept, but not so much so when you get assholes like Stalin and Hitler Implementing it.
Where are my leftists at?: 6/27/2015 20:57:40


OxTheAutist 
Level 58
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- anti-imperialist Check
- anti-fascist Check
- anti-capitalist Mostly, but not communist
- opposed to all forms of structural oppression I believe so, but I'm sure someone's going to come up with something that proves me wrong here. So I'll say over 90%
- sympathetic to the idea of worker control of the means of production Check
Where are my leftists at?: 6/27/2015 21:53:23


shyb
Level 59
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ok to be more specific, i tend to agree with anarcho-syndicalism. so, just about as far left as you can go.
Where are my leftists at?: 6/27/2015 22:51:10


Benjamin628 
Level 59
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Republican X

Democrat X

Awake
Where are my leftists at?: 6/27/2015 23:01:48


Eklipse
Level 57
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- anti-imperialist
Check.
- anti-fascist
Check.
- anti-capitalist
Check.
- opposed to all forms of structural oppression
You'll have to be more specific on this one. The word oppression is thrown around quite a bit.
- sympathetic to the idea of worker control of the means of production
Check.
Where are my leftists at?: 6/28/2015 01:41:17


berdan131
Level 56
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I think more important with simple distinction between left or right is something different.

Namely, to have an authority/government which follows the will of its people, state officials who are responsible for their actions and above all a wise folk who doesn't get manipulated and know how fight for their rights and take action in case of oppression.

To avoid situations like in this video:
How western elites poison us and the world:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Hj3LGvWWLU

When someone who is in power is against its own people we have a problem...
People are unaware because such taboo topics are avoided in mass-media.
I have hundreds of videos... Its all part of a bigger thing.

Edited 6/28/2015 01:44:58
Where are my leftists at?: 6/28/2015 01:42:21


The Mad Japanese
Level 51
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I'm more of a Socio-Liberal, not a Extreme Left but in the Middle of the Left
Where are my leftists at?: 6/28/2015 07:19:39


Genghis 
Level 54
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I've always been skeptical about fluoride. I've thought fluoride was just one of the many impurities that is caused by water refineries.
Where are my leftists at?: 6/28/2015 07:41:44


Rogue Nikolai Krogius
Level 58
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Im an Anarchist. I think that counts...
Where are my leftists at?: 6/28/2015 15:27:54


Red
Level 32
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^Anarchists is the furthest you can get from the left.
Where are my leftists at?: 6/28/2015 16:49:55


Drackoe
Level 59
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Authoritarian vs libertarian has more actual significance than terms left left/right or liberal/conservative, imo. Plenty of capitalist systems show more respect for the individual worker than some ostensibly communist regimes like, say, North Korea or do.

In the USA at least, the "left" is socially liberal, but economically authoritarian. The "right" is socially authoritarian yet economically liberal. It shows how politics and ideology really don't have as much overlap as you'd think.

It's also the same reason "anarchists" can label themselves as "left." Yeah, socially they are. Economically they're anything but "left" in modern political parlance.

Edited 6/28/2015 16:53:20
Where are my leftists at?: 6/28/2015 19:31:31


shyb
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you could say the right in america is economically authoritarian because their policies make the rich richer and the poor poorer, and put even more power in the hands of multinational corporations (arguably the real rulers of our country). the left want more controls on the economy but only to keep those at the top from gaming the system. in my view an even playing field is what the left are after, which is antithetical to authoritarians.

it is tricky defining this stuff because it is seen differently by both sides.

and of course im only talking about america.
Where are my leftists at?: 6/29/2015 08:42:53


knyte 
Level 58
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So for the purpose of this thread:

left:

anti-capitalist
anti-imperialist
generally opposed to structural oppression

right:

usually capitalist
opposes anti-imperialism and anti-colonialism on some level (or finds those movements problematic)
does not focus on ending structural oppression, although may be opposed to centralized governments that limit property rights or states' rights
Where are my leftists at?: 6/30/2015 01:54:48


The Cruelest
Level 56
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Your close. Let me elaborate.

For those of us who live in America here is the Republican platform https://www.gop.com/platform/.

Here is the democrat platform. https://www.democrats.org/party-platform

In America, the Republicans sit on the right side of the aisle and Democrats sit on the left side of the aisle in case you didn't know that.

Here is the summary of the Democrat platform. http://www.ontheissues.org/Archive/2012_DNC_Platform_Democratic_Party.htm

Here is a summary of the republican platform.
http://www.ontheissues.org/Archive/2012_RNC_Platform_Republican_Party.htm

As you can see the Democrats support more (not total) socialism in the economy. They want welfare, medicare, obamacare, medicaid, high corporate tax rates and entitlements all of which INCREASE the governments control of the economy.

They also support REMOVING the government from people's personal lives. They also support the US responsibly withdrawing from Iraq and Afghanistan which may be an imperialist issue or it may be a safety issue.

The Democrats are indeed opposed to Capitalism and (perceived) imperialism but sometimes they want more structural oppression (like the ACA) and sometimes they want less. That is the left.

The Republicans on the other hand want more (not total) capitalism in the economy. They don't like welfare, medicare, obamacare, medicaid, high corporate tax rates and entitlements which INCREASE government control of the economy. The republican economic approach can be best summarized as "laissez faire", literally meaning "leave it alone."

On domestic issues the Republicans support MORE government control of people's personal lives. They used to stand against gay marriage. They wish to limit late-term abortions. Republicans also extremely hate Russian Imperialism especially with the events of Donbass.

The Republicans are opposed to Socialism and foriegn Imperialism but sometimes they want more structural oppression (like the government surveillance programs) and sometimes they want less (like destroying entitlements and the ACA).

TLDR: You, knyte, make it seem like you have to be a Communist or a Socialist to be part of the left and you need to be a Fascist to be part of the left. The facts are that MORE people are in the middle(liberals, conservatives) of the political divide than out at the ends(Communist/Socialist, Fascist). The facts are that nobody actually supports Colonialism/Imperialism anymore in the west because it is so unpopular. You will only find that in Russia (a leftist country).

Edited 6/30/2015 01:56:12
Where are my leftists at?: 6/30/2015 01:58:48


[Wolf] {F} Kellen the Conquerer
Level 51
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I hate Liberals.

My ideals are:

Support gay marriage
Kill all murderers
Let them come from Mexico, teach them. Don't kick them out
Stahp Media Bias
Where are my leftists at?: 6/30/2015 02:45:16


Lawlz
Level 40
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>Tfw Eklipse claims left when he's really a right

:p
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