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Mapmakers are underrated: 2/11/2015 01:27:47


eliod 
Level 57
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Hallo Mapmaker!

I mean... I really like to create Maps.
But am I to fastidious, with that funny feeling, Warlight gives a s#!t on it?
Hey! I know... my only payment is the recognition of other players. And that's ok, so long.

I don't understand, why the maps a mapmaker made are not shown at the profile. You can see every Boot, every Victory, every Surrender, the time you need for a turn, how many games you are playing... nearly every fart. I am conceited enough for showing my maps on my profile, using that Favorite Maps-slots (that's part of my payment!). But it's only a bad compromise solution.

Another point which shows Warlights disregard for Map making (in my opinion) are this Achievements for everything - except making a map. - Yes, there is a special Achievement given by the grace of Fizzer - and that's ok, but why there is no auto-Achievement? You get them for rating a map (10 seconds). Making a Map could partially means over 100 (200, 300...) hours work.

Yes, I wouldn't do it, if I won't have fun with it. But what would warlight be, without the artwork of Incaman, Troll, [中国阳朔]TexasJohn, RA, Срећко, Apollo, The King [Belgian gentleman] or Ranek (just to name a few). I guess they are more important than the strategical Top-Players, who get all statistics the vanity needs on their profile.

Warlight advertises with having over 1.000 Maps (Ok, to be true: 800 are unplayable. In my opinion it would be ok to delete Maps, which are not played for a year) - Warlight makes money with it. I would like to have my recognition-part of it or at least the feeling Warlight pays the same respect for map making then for playing.

Edited 2/11/2015 01:38:07
Mapmakers are underrated: 2/11/2015 01:30:59


Thomas 633
Level 56
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I try to play uncommon maps, maybe the map of the week auto-game could include an under-played but fun map, as well as the winner of the voting.
Mapmakers are underrated: 2/11/2015 01:42:10


zxctycxz [Ollie Bye] 
Level 57
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I'd go as far as to say the really high-end map makers should have some kind of special thing by their name or something, like how for Fizzer it says 'WarLight Creator' or something like that. We're saving him loads of work by making all these amazing creations, and we're doing it all for free.
Mapmakers are underrated: 2/11/2015 01:55:49


TBest 
Level 60
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Remember that creating a map is the equivalent of Warzone having to pay storage for that map for the rest of its existence. Sure, Mapmakers are important, however they do not come free. Remeber that many finds it fun to make maps, and with the current number of mapmakers and maps, Warzone has no need to encourecge more people to make them.

As for why maps are never deleted. Warzone have a policy of all played games to be accessible after they are played: read played games are never deleted. In order to view those games the map has to be available.

That Being said, I do agree; old games, and never played maps could be deleted. I believe Fizzer sees it as part of how Warzone distinguishes itself. Your game, map and User account is never deleted.

P.S Don't get me wrong, I am incredible grateful for all the great maps i can choose between.

What if in addition to the achievement given by Fizzer, you got some coins?

Also
I don't understand, why the maps a mapmaker made are not shown at the profile.

+1.
Mapmakers are underrated: 2/11/2015 02:01:24


Жұқтыру
Level 55
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I don't agree with your first point, really. Map storage for most maps is negligible.
Mapmakers are underrated: 2/11/2015 02:24:18


TBest 
Level 60
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Absolutely, one map is "nothing" however they do stack up and together they are not nothing. (Through it might still be negligible) Also I forgot to mention that all version of a map that has been played on, is stored as well. Thus (95% sure) some maps are in a sense stored multiple times, as the updated map gets available the old version is not deleted.

Anyway, main point was "with the current number of mapmakers and maps, Warzone has no need to encourecge more people to make them"

Edited 2/11/2015 02:27:56
Mapmakers are underrated: 2/11/2015 02:44:51


Жұқтыру
Level 55
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Warlight's been online for, how many years, 7 now? Though the maps stack up, that's seven years' worth of maps, the first few of which had no map regulations. And it still might be negligible, and if it isn't, it's not terribly expensive to buy more storage.

I think the more, the merrier.
Mapmakers are underrated: 2/11/2015 02:48:40


Thomas 633
Level 56
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Old Earth got deleted...
Mapmakers are underrated: 2/11/2015 03:01:18


TBest 
Level 60
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You can't make new games with the map, however it is not deleted. If you deleted old maps, you could also delete old games from that map, and inactive accounts, who only played on said maps. Therefore when we talk about deleting maps, we are really talking about going from keeping everything to, deleting old stuff. Something that is no longer negligible storage.

Now, shall we try to get back on topic?
Mapmakers are underrated: 2/11/2015 03:05:19


Thomas 633
Level 56
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For people who haven't seen the old earth map:
https://www.warlight.net/MultiPlayer?GameID=1000123
Mapmakers are underrated: 2/11/2015 04:18:44


Beren • apex 
Level 63
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You can actually create games on old versions of maps if you have a link to a game or a template which was played on it. You just create a game from that template, then customize the settings. You can modify any aspect of it just like normal. The only thing is that you have to be sure not to click on the Maps tab, since that will then cause it to tell you that that map does not exist.
Mapmakers are underrated: 2/11/2015 05:09:13


eliod 
Level 57
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Top-performance like getting 1,000 rates or keeping a 4.7-rating over a month are definitely worth an golden Achievement. Being the Creator of the Map of the week is worth to be mentioned in a Profile. And even making a single Map should be mentioned there. This are information which are part of the Warlight-concept. And only because someone likes math more than art, doesn't change this fact.

I know, that Warlight could survive without every single Mapmaker.
But there is no need, to show it.
Mapmakers are underrated: 2/11/2015 07:26:07


skunk940 
Level 58
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As a mapmaker I can say that all map makers would like a bit more recognition, but at the end of the day we make maps because we enjoy making maps, and just have people playing those maps is more then enough for us.

Also deleting old maps. No no no.
Mapmakers are underrated: 2/11/2015 08:58:17


eliod 
Level 57
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Hey skunk940 (I love your Solar-System-Map!)

Sure, you are damn right. Nevertheless: You use your Favorite Map-slots for representing a part of your Maps, too. You even mention that you are a mapmaker in your Bio. And that's all right.

In my opinion, this shouldn't be your job alone. - So, you released 33 Map's? A pitty I only could get me an overview by clicking through 1,000 Maps.

Ok, ok... nobody should delete Maps! :-)
Mapmakers are underrated: 2/11/2015 17:11:31


Ranek
Level 55
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I agree with you eliod. Obviously the 'mapmaker community', those who make frequently medium to high quality maps isnt very big and doesnt need to be encouraged to keep on working. It is the creating process, that most mapmakers enjoy and the presentation part, when maps went public and the warlight community could appreciate your contribution is disappointing. Unfortunately it is always disappointing to present a project, where you have spend months to work on to other guys, that cant even imagine, which amount of effort you have put in.

Nevertheless it shouldnt be such a big deal to enlarge the profiles about some mapmaker features, like those you have mentioned. A counter for each map, that shows how often a map was played, would be nice, too.
A better integration of the mapmaking aspect of warlight into the entire game concept could have several more positive side effects. For example user votes for new map themes.
Mapmakers are underrated: 2/11/2015 17:37:59

Fizzer 
Level 58

Warzone Creator
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I suspect that pretty much every area of WarLight feels neglected. Clan members have tons of features they want, so do ladder players, and tournament players, and coin players, and real-time players, and multi-day players, and people who play with AI, and mobile app users, and map makers, etc.

I agree that adding a list of maps created to profiles would be a great feature, and I hope to add it some day. However, it's competing against a thousand other great features and I only have time to do less than 1% of them. The fact is, there's only one person adding features to the game, so it's impossible to add everything. And I even have to split my time between adding features and doing taxes, support, marketing, legal, and trying to make the site profitable (which really trumps everything, since if the site isn't profitable then all other areas cease to exist). Right now I'm working on tournaments, which has not had a significant upgrade since 2011 (four years!).

I will say this about achievements though: A lot of people play games as achievement-hunters. They make it their goal to get every achievement. The achievement system was set up with this in mind, so there are no achievements that are super difficult to get (difficult ones are reserved for trophies).

If there was an achievement for making a map public, for example, then that would cause all of the achievement hunters to make a simple map just to get the achievement. They'd put forth the minimum effort required to get the achievement. Two circles and a line connecting them, boom, achievement. We'd see hundreds of these stupid maps get created, and that isn't good for anyone as it floods the maps area with low quality maps.

As you guys all know, creating a great WarLight map takes a lot of dedication, passion, and patience. Not everyone is cut out for it, and it isn't something that we want to try and encourage *everyone* to do. Just the people who actually enjoy making maps. So a conscious decision was made to exclude achievements for making maps, so that achievement hunters would not be forced to try and make one.
Mapmakers are underrated: 2/11/2015 17:46:43


ChrisCMU 
Level 60
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I don't care about an achievement (a gold trophy would be cool, but nothing else interests me there).

I also don't care much about recognition from Fizzer that I made a map (he does not have the time to evaluate the quality of every map). I care about people rating my map high, that tells me people who played it liked it.

It would be cool to see them listed on my profile, but I already do that to some extent because they are also my favorite ones on the profile. Personally, I'd rather see the favorite maps on there changed to favorite templates. Sometimes the template makes the map.

In short, I don't feel neglected. All I ask is people to try my maps (more specifically my templates posted on the map page) and give me ratings/feedback. Fizzer has already done steps to help there with his map of the week series. Also, he takes suggestions for most seasonal ladders as well, which is another chance to highlight newer maps. So I thank him for that (bringing more exposure to maps).

If you want to get map makers recognition (which I appreciate). Help get people to stop playing lotto games, and instead try some of these maps which are underplayed. We the players can fix any issue with underrating map makers. Not all maps are equal, and the users determine which are good and which are bad.

Edited 2/11/2015 17:50:33
Mapmakers are underrated: 2/12/2015 18:01:23


eliod 
Level 57
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Chris! You got a lot achievements by mistake :-) Hey... I started fake-games with friends to get achievements like "well timed victory", "Eliminate yourself" or "Peaceful Nation". Nevertheless, many points you say are true.
Na..., it's not my intend to get new achievements for more Level-Poins. In fact, a Level beyond the 50s make it very harder to find opponents in open Matches.
And you also use the Favorite Map-slots for showing your Maps like most Mapmaker do. There is a demand for that, for sure.

Hey Fizzer! I really don't expect a reply by you. Thank you!
I see... we have the same problem: our work is underestimated. :-)
Well, I am happy you also think that adding a list of maps created to profiles would be a great feature. And it's great, that you may keep this idea somewhere in your mind to convert it some day.
You are right with this achievement-problem. Let it like it is.
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