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A question of etiquette: 3/27/2013 22:50:26


Ko 
Level 60
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Ok - I am still new to the community, and have looked for posts about boot/surrender/Vote to end etiquette, and can't find any. My question is this: Are there any rules/guidelines posted anywhere concerning when those options are relevant?

I joined a 2v2 Auto game the other day where my partner disappeared after making his (horrific) territory selections. Opponents booted him like clockwork - which I can accept - but then refused "vote to end" and even refused to accept my surrender! When I suggested politely that we end the game one way or the other, the only response was:

why don't you step in my gauntlet Bitchnuts?

(I don't know if others can see the chat in the linked game)
http://WarLight.net/MultiPlayer?GameID=4015993

The language doesn't bother me in the least, but making me play a 1v2 from turn 1 is just really petty, IMHO. I withdrew the surrender, and proceeded to actually beat them, so I got the last laugh, but my question remains:

When is it "generally acceptable" to ask for VTE? I really *want* to try the "random team" games, but it seems like half of them involve someone dropping within the first 2 turns -- why is it that people won't agree to a VTE? I am also mystified that they didn't accept my surrender...
A question of etiquette: 3/28/2013 00:59:56


Smoker 
Level 58
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you were unlucky to meet 2 nasty players who were afraid to play a fair game. There are plenty of decent people in warlight.
A question of etiquette: 3/28/2013 01:06:37


Alfred the Great
Level 58
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"you just jealous of our #YOLOSWAG"

What does that even mean?

At least you demolished them 1v2. That must have been satisfying.
A question of etiquette: 3/28/2013 01:14:54


Frankdeslimste • apex 
Level 58
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Trust me, you don't wanna know...

But there is always Google if you really must know.
A question of etiquette: 3/28/2013 06:29:42


[WG] Warlightvet 
Level 16
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no, that's standard procedure.
If you're against a team in a 2V1 (when you're the 2) you should always insult them and proceed to try to eliminate them and fail.

jk, if the boot occurs before the game was decided in the booting team's favor, then they should vote.
surrenders should always be accepted except in some cases in ffas
A question of etiquette: 3/28/2013 08:41:49


hedja 
Level 58
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You should always vote to end if game ends unfairly. Most people say the first 5 turns can be voted, but after that the game is too developed to vote, since they might have left because they know they are going to lose.

Good job defeating them both, looking at their picks it is quite depressing, they re much noobier than you and also dickheads, so blacklist them and don't play with them again.
A question of etiquette: 3/28/2013 08:58:55


x 
Level 58
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... so did you step in his gauntlet?
A question of etiquette: 3/28/2013 09:36:35


Mike |GG| 
Level 61
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It was a pleasure to see you won that game! Good Job. Don't bother about those players most of poeple here would vote to end in that situation, you got exceptions like everywhere. Thats why you got blacklist to put players on it. And remember do not boot without reason and deffinitly not at clock time, now its little better because players can take back control from AI after beeing booted (when its in game settings).
A question of etiquette: 3/28/2013 10:01:19


aper 
Level 56
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http://WarLight.net/MultiPlayer?GameID=4015993
This game was hilarious. I had a good laugh at these two assholes looking for a cheap 2v1 win and ending up getting their asses kicked. also, blacklisted.
I think OP is my favorite new player;)

On your topic-question, there are no "rules" on boot/VTE , it all comes down to your personal perception on what will be considered "fair" in the given situation. I think the majority agrees to VTE only in the first 1-2 turns.
But after all the point of a game should be having fun and not padding stats..

I personally:
don't direct-boot(especially if there is auto-boot), unless someone deliberately tried to stall the game
never VTE when someone boots his teammate. (I mean, c'mon...)
tend not to accept surrenders in FFA, unless I'm the last one left to accepted it
(and these are no guidelines ofc, just what I like to do)
A question of etiquette: 3/28/2013 11:13:15


sasha grey
Level 54
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vte happens in first 5 turns and only if neither of teams haven't screwed up already
A question of etiquette: 3/28/2013 11:28:46


professor dead piggy 
Level 59
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Always VTE, if anyone so much as mentions the possibility, never boot. Act like a fucking gentleman, jesus. The reason these problems occur is playing games with low prereqs. Noone who requires 50%+ winrate in 1v1 and 3v3, 500 games minimum and a bootrate below 5% needs a blacklist or to ever worry about a game being ruined by not voting to end.

Also stop worrying about your stats. If a game is no longer fun, leave, Stat whores.
A question of etiquette: 3/28/2013 11:41:02


ps 
Level 60
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have looked for posts about boot/surrender/Vote to end etiquette, and can't find any.


you must really suck at searching then because i remember atleast 2 of them during last month alone.
A question of etiquette: 3/31/2013 21:50:35


Ko 
Level 60
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Thanks *ever* so much for your helpful reply PS!

Actually, I *did* search the forums for "VTE" and read all 7 resulting threads -- none of which really adressed VTE etiquette. I also tried searching for "boot" and "surrender" but as you might imagine, the results were far from usable. Unfortunately the forum tools here are relatively primitive (as far as I can see), and I couldn't find a way to refine the search or organize the results. Therefore the new thread.

Everyone else - thanks for the encouragement. I've indeed found most people here friendly and reasonable. Decent players looking for a good game, please feel free to invite me to a game (multi-day please). This is your chance to spank me while I'm green - and I might just give you a good game....

By the way, Aper, who is this "OP" you speak of? ;)
A question of etiquette: 3/31/2013 22:02:37


[WM] แต€แดดแดฑ๐“•๐“ป๐“ฒ๐“ญ๐“ฐ๐“ฎ 
Level 59
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+1 on what deadpiggy said - with some exceptions for blacklisted people (if those are for early booting, or similar reasons i will consider not voting in their favor, and i will be more eager to boot them in case they were added to blacklist for early booting - karma, baby...)



i believe by "OP" aper meant "original poster" - which is you, Ko_in_DK
A question of etiquette: 4/1/2013 03:10:58

Kantos
Level 60
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nice game Ko_in_DK
normaly when the game has someone who get booted in early rounds,(if not a tournament) many people use vote to end
it just happen that u get to play agaisnt bad players
A question of etiquette: 4/1/2013 03:23:45

SMD4FREE
Level 2
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dont be too surprised, Ko_in_DK

If i'm playing with randoms, I rarely VTE, even if the opposing team asks for it, I just pretend to be a typical chinaman and dont understand his pleas, usually pisses them off, which can be entertaining. :P

but in the future, f they really dont vte, just stall, do your orders and only commit when there's like... 5 seconds left. :D
A question of etiquette: 4/4/2013 08:50:39


Ko 
Level 60
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Confucius say:

Never piss off chinaman, especially when you are eating in his restaurant.
That "special sauce" may end up with extra special ingredient.

P.S. Love the stereotype about chinese people! Xenophobia rules!
A question of etiquette: 4/4/2013 09:31:59


ps 
Level 60
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Thanks *ever* so much for your helpful reply PS!


no problem.

next time i'll provide a lmgtfy link such as this
http://lmgtfy.com/?q=vote+and+boot+etiquette+warlight

where the fourth link, dated from February 27th refers to a warlight forum thread named
"booting from the game" by a new warlight user Graham Arnold
http://warlight.net/Forum/Thread?ThreadID=5475
which includes an immediate answer by this ever so helpful ps guy and a few other follow up responders addressing this exact issue.

It reads, and i quote:

if it's a new guy to the game, with high boot rate, he most probably doesnt know where the surrender button is or is playing the annoying timewaster so it's acceptable to boot.

if it's an old guy to the game, with low boot rate, he most probably lost connection or went to do something afk and will be back shortly so it's advisable to just wait a few more minutes.

eitherway it's common courtesy to warn the other team first and if autoboot is in place let the autoboot do the booting.

i would suggest it to be a smart policy to just blacklist people who boot precociously and move on to another game instead of indulging in chat drama. you already have the game ruined, no use wasting more time on it. blacklisting people who don't respect boot etiquette will make sure you don't play with them in the future or atleast give you a heads up not to go over the time limit when playing against them.


Although i do hate to promote incompetence and lack of accountabillity: yeah, you're welcome.

You might want to learn how to search though.

Especially when you claim to have done it, and clearly have not.

It would not only prevent you from looking like an idiot who can't do a simple search on the very topic you're posting about but also not waste mine (and others) time writing you off on it. a win win situation, no need to boot, surrender or vote to end.
A question of etiquette: 4/4/2013 12:50:31


Ironheart
Level 53
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but in the future, f they really dont vte, just stall, do your orders and only commit when there's like... 5 seconds left.

Nice way to get blacklisted.
A question of etiquette: 4/4/2013 13:29:31

SMD4FREE
Level 2
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dont worry, iron, i cant care less. there are thousands others i can play with.
A question of etiquette: 4/5/2013 02:46:16


Master ARC 
Level 57
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right, but theres only like - what - fifty people that actively post on the forum?

blacklisted, btw
A question of etiquette: 4/7/2013 22:13:06


Ko 
Level 60
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Although I'm tempted to point out the logic flaws in your posts, PS, but I really don't want to start a pissing match with you (you seem angry enough already for some reason). I do, however, feel obligated to respond.

First off, thank you for the link. The thread is actually *somewhat* related to the topic I was interested in. Although the long quote you provided doesn't even mention vote-to-end, there is some discussion of it further down on the thread.

The problem is that the forum search tools, which I did use, give very little help in finding what you need unless you are already aware of it's existence (there is no search within search, nor are there any operators that allow you to fine-tune a search). I actually spent a bit of time browsing the 80 hits from "boot" and "surrender" searches (the forum only shows you 40 each) and read all the threads with "VTE" in their entirety. But I found nothing that answered my question directly - therefore the post.

By the way, I do understand the issue of people posting before searching, but your responses are unnecessarily insulting (and the first was particularly unhelpful). A little bit of politeness goes a long way....
A question of etiquette: 4/7/2013 22:44:32


Accept my Surrender
Level 10
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Ko_in_DK I have to say your the first gentleman I ever have seen on the internet. I hereby give you my honorary imaginary reward cookie; Please enjoy it.
A question of etiquette: 4/7/2013 22:51:36


[WG] Warlightvet 
Level 16
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we don't want you here
you're too mature
-.-
makes the rest of us look bad
and stop being right when giving your opinion on my moves in 2V2 -.-
A question of etiquette: 4/7/2013 23:08:30


Naomi
Level 40
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Don't mind Warlightvet. He gets grumpy whenever someone proves him wrong. Something about being an arrogant French person or whatever along those lines.
I'm actually glad the interwebs aren't full of trolling baboons... It makes forums more fun to partake in :P
A question of etiquette: 4/8/2013 08:17:41


ps 
Level 60
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Ko_in_DK: Sorry about that. It annoys me that people post before searching properly, and yours seemed like a clear case of that.
A question of etiquette: 4/8/2013 10:05:59


Ko 
Level 60
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Well I must say I'm pleasantly surprised by your response, PS. To be honest, I was expecting something particularly venemous, and actually considered deleting my post after I'd written it -- although I see there are no edit/delete options in the forum. Apology accepted! (and hats off to you for "backing down" - that's not always an easy thing to do).

As for Warlight, it's totally fine - I know he's just embittered by the fact that he's past his prime. At least he's still sharp enough to recognize superior analysis (from a noob, no less), and man enough to admit it in public! :P

BACK TO THE ORIGINAL SUBJECT:
It would be great to see a single (ideally "sticky") thread concerning the appropriate use of Boot & VTE (and nudge/vote-to-boot for that matter). I would guess that at least 1/3 of my games involve someone disappearing for days at a time, and the rest of us sort of wondering (and sometimes discussing in chat) what to do about it. I do love the fact that these options exist, and the Wiki is great for understanding what they do, but that's not the place for discussion/opinion.

Obviously there are no set answers (personally, I am reluctant to boot unless it's a FFA and the person has been MIA for several days) but some basic usage guidelines would help alot of new players, I think. Are there any active forum moderaters with the tools to create stickies?
A question of etiquette: 4/8/2013 10:19:10


Aranka 
Level 43
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That is assuming that basic noob/new players would take the effort to go on this forum and check all the guidelines.
IMO they don't

Furthermore, most active players already have a good image of the accepted etiquete here so won't benefit from such a sticky.
I'm all right with a sticky, although I just question the use it will have
A question of etiquette: 4/8/2013 11:40:41


powerpos
Level 48
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you must be new to online gaming

golden rule : If the game lets you do something you 're allowed to do it.

for crappy team mates only create/join games with reasonable prerequisites,
don't join games where people with a boot-% of over 10(or 15, or 5, however you feel) are allowed to join.

congrats on the win though ^_^
A question of etiquette: 4/8/2013 11:48:55


professor dead piggy 
Level 59
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Powerneg, bro, that isnt even close to the golden rule: "One should treat others as one would like others to treat oneself" ~ Wikipedia
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