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Challenge. ReLite vs WM: 3/27/2013 11:20:49


Mike |GG| 
Level 61
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Hello Warlight community :D

I want to create a challenge, competition between two clans ReLite and WM.
I hereby request with question if the clan [WM] is interested of joining?
Please report the people of the clan [WM] willing to take part in this competition. By the way, please suggest the map and the type of competition. Personally I suggest: three games 2vs2, two games 3vs3 and one big gameplay 6vs6 . So a minimum of 6 players from each team.
Challenge. ReLite vs WM: 3/27/2013 11:31:01

SMD4FREE
Level 2
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if WM doesn't play, RSP are up for the challenge.We only have 6-8 active people, and we're not as good as the WMs, but I think we are around your level.
Challenge. ReLite vs WM: 3/27/2013 11:35:00


[WM] Gnuffone 
Level 60
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this is very interesting.
if other WM are ok for play, i will play for sure, i like challenge :P
but first we have to speak about some things:
-temaplate
-all games worth one point? or 3v3 worth more then 2v2?
-why no 1v1?
Challenge. ReLite vs WM: 3/27/2013 11:54:17


Mike |GG| 
Level 61
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Everything is still up to debate, of course.
1vs1 rather show individual capabilities instead of team play and I would like to have a challenge based on team play instead of individual. Bet on team competition.
Points:
2vs2 - 2
3vs3 - 3
6vs6 - 3 (obviously not 6, its too much points since game is almost 50/50% to win)
Settings:
0%luck, straight round.
Map:
2vs2 - strategic 2vs2 same as in ladder
3vs3 - china big or small
Challenge. ReLite vs WM: 3/27/2013 11:57:28


Mike |GG| 
Level 61
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Actually 1vs1 can also be possible i dont have anything against it.
1vs1 - 1 point, strategic 1vs1 map or imperium romanum.
Challenge. ReLite vs WM: 3/27/2013 12:59:44


[WG] Warlightvet 
Level 16
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rsp as good as relite
yea, definitely
warlighters too, i didn't know how bad relite was until now (;
Challenge. ReLite vs WM: 3/27/2013 13:26:16


[WM] Gnuffone 
Level 60
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[/rsp as good as relite
yea, definitely
warlighters too, i didn't know how bad relite was until now (; ]

now relite are the worst clan XD
Challenge. ReLite vs WM: 3/27/2013 13:31:55

SMD4FREE
Level 2
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ahhh of course, there goes warlightrat and his usual sense of superiority! How surprising.
why not rat, i hope you realized the 1v1 game i played with you was a joke :P

i challenge you and your warlighter boys to a 3v3 eu, what do you say, rat?
Challenge. ReLite vs WM: 3/27/2013 13:56:17

Qi 
Level 55
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team games: relite wins
1v1s: wm wins
Challenge. ReLite vs WM: 3/27/2013 13:58:17


Ⓖ. Ⓐrun 
Level 57
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Pulsey, go for it. I'll create a game with you with our players in it.
Challenge. ReLite vs WM: 3/27/2013 14:04:52

SMD4FREE
Level 2
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haha ok, so you, rat and who else? i'll make the game. 16% luck, manual dis, no cards, ok?
Challenge. ReLite vs WM: 3/27/2013 15:35:02


Ⓖ. Ⓐrun 
Level 57
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Put me, Warlightvet and Polakillo in it then. I'm happy with those settings. Which Europe map are you thinking?
Challenge. ReLite vs WM: 3/27/2013 19:15:02


hedja 
Level 58
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Qi, why Relite winning team games? I think WM have very good 3vs3 teams, especially Gnuff and Szew. Both teams have very good sides, but my money is on [WM]
Challenge. ReLite vs WM: 3/27/2013 19:42:14


[WM] ᵀᴴᴱ𝓕𝓻𝓲𝓭𝓰𝓮 
Level 59
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I could smell that coming for a long long time, but I am very surprised it's Jupiter, not Aranka announcing it. I'll be more than happy to play this challenge.
Challenge. ReLite vs WM: 3/27/2013 20:15:05


[WM] Anonymous 
Level 52
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We are glad to accept your challenge, but why you want to play a 6v6? From my personal experience with the international cup, where we had to play 1v1 2v2 3v3 and even 7v7 (later become 5v5), that last game wasn't that much "skill indicator".
Challenge. ReLite vs WM: 3/27/2013 22:17:33

DagenDaDragon (ReTIRED OF WARLIGHT) 
Level 34
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I dunno large team games are for sure a skill thing.
The more players a team, the harder it is to coordinate picks, get a good plan for the game, good tactics. Do you want everyone in combat, do you want to cluster, spread, etc.
I just don't think anyone plays enough of the large team games to begin getting that skilled.
I'm basing this off of the fact that 1v1s I find and have noticed the easiest type of games to learn, then 2v2's then 3v3's etc.
I'm not in any way suggesting I'm good at any of these. :P
So it'd be cool to see if [WM] and ReLite who both have large(enough) talented player bases to do a 6v6 with all very talented players, if they could begin to delve into and see if there is any strategic possibility to a 6V6.
Challenge. ReLite vs WM: 3/27/2013 23:03:56


szeweningen 
Level 60
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Yeah, you have no idea what you're talking about Dagen...

Challenge. ReLite vs WM: 3/27/2013 23:06:19


[WM] Anonymous 
Level 52
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Also you can exchange the Y with "Attention you put in teamwork".
When i play more than 4 in a team, i really don't give a fuck about the others. I watch only my part of map. I would go crazy to chech...don't know 6-7-8 orders :/
Challenge. ReLite vs WM: 3/27/2013 23:43:07


professor dead piggy 
Level 59
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Oh god Sze that graph... 2 out of the 3 players in a 3v3 just need enough skill to shut up and do what theyre told (by you). 1v1 specialists are the masterrace of WL.
Challenge. ReLite vs WM: 3/28/2013 03:42:47

Qi 
Level 55
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i agree with sze. any graph (of skill vs # of players/team) should look like a woman's breasts from the side angle. but i disagree with the perfectly flat stomach. women come in different shapes and sizes. but based on sze's graph, it doesn't make sense why he can easily reach #1 on the 1v1 ladder and gnuff has too. but as a team they made odd picks/moves so they were only the 5th or 6th best active ladder team.

hedja, it depends on who plays the team games for wm. randomly select players from wm, and relite wins. pick wm's best team players only, wm wins.

dead, wl is all about 1v1 me. that's why i call it 1v1 me, bc when many of these 'me' players play a team game requiring 'team' coordination, they still think more about 'me' than 'team'.
Challenge. ReLite vs WM: 3/28/2013 05:23:41


professor dead piggy 
Level 59
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Qi there is no such thing as "team coordination". I think you put 'team' in apostrophes because even you dont believe it. A 3 person team is one person with one plan directing 2 other peoples armies. It is no less about oneself than a 1v1. Sze demonstrates that every single game. =P
Challenge. ReLite vs WM: 3/28/2013 05:40:09

Qi 
Level 55
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sze does enjoy being a puppet master.
Challenge. ReLite vs WM: 3/28/2013 09:32:30


Aranka 
Level 43
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Gnuffone does so more then swe though. Swe usually can't be bothered while Gnu will describe every singular move order in detail
Challenge. ReLite vs WM: 3/28/2013 11:50:41


ps 
Level 60
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just wanted to add 2 cents: the 5v5, 6vs6 and 7v7 have some interest because it grows further out of the one leader controlling everything and more down to folks helping each other out, covering the map well, supporting each other, knowing when they are more useful sacrificing themselfs. so i can't really agree with that chart, even if it does look like a boob as Gui pointed out. But yeah, i agree most of those games are won more pickings lottery then actual skill, but i still woulnd't paint such a dark scenario as some of you do.
Challenge. ReLite vs WM: 3/28/2013 12:28:08


[WM] Gnuffone 
Level 60
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On a 7v7 is required less skill.
picking lotery often decide match.
Challenge. ReLite vs WM: 3/28/2013 12:41:15


professor dead piggy 
Level 59
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Gnuffone: If 7v7 requires less skill than a 3v3, why doesn't a 3v3 require less skill than a 1v1. The picks you get are a lottery in 3v3 europe.
Challenge. ReLite vs WM: 3/28/2013 12:46:26


[WM] Gnuffone 
Level 60
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LOL
i take your post as a joke...


in 7v7 there are less spot for eash player
and the best place are < number of player
so if there are for example 3 best bonus and 14 player, who take 2 of it might have a greeat ahead.
in 3v3 eu ISN'T a lottery.
Challenge. ReLite vs WM: 3/28/2013 12:55:04


x 
Level 58
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I think it is more the total number of picks that is the problem. On the 3v3 Euro template that is in vogue, there are 24 total picks. Maybe with the first picks there can be some skill, but there is absolutely no science to deciding which pick should be your 20th and which your 21st. Sometimes you end up with a combination of 4 that work terribly together.

So, a 7v7 with one pick each should be less of a "lottery" than Gnuff's 3v3 Euro games.
Challenge. ReLite vs WM: 3/28/2013 12:55:18

Qi 
Level 55
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more armies (income) pumped into a map = less subtlety needed to play efficiently/smoothly and with good tactics and strategies

this is why I prefer no reinforcement cards and bonus ratios closer to .6 than to 1.0

give an idiot a big income and he'll do some things right. give an idiot a low income and he'll make more mistakes because every army lost or gained matters. this is why idiots love big maps so much and better players play more games on maps of 100 to 300 territories. only eastern asia provides something both general types of players like.
Challenge. ReLite vs WM: 3/28/2013 13:02:54

Qi 
Level 55
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6v6 or 7v7: mismatches/tagteaming/gangbanging are too common. how can you make long-term strategic plans if a second third or fourth enemy pops out of nowhere? with 3v3s this element is limited and is a stabler variable in long-term planning. this added stability makes abbig difference.
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