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Is Army Camp Boost really the best Artifact?: 4/16/2021 21:56:59


asdfgh
Level 17
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Just finished Afro-Eurasia Gargantuan (well almost, I have one territory left that I'm waiting to conquer after my last dig starts) and here are my Army Stats

Army Camp ~247.7 B
Mercenary ~567.9 B
Cache ~352.6 B
Drafting ~269.3 B

My stats/Info:

Still had ~114 B Mercenaries that I didn't buy.
Started with all my Powers except only 4 Fog Busters and 2 Multi Levels, finish with full powers except 2 Multi Levels.
Army Camps was making 302K/sec (counting Army Camp Boost), no Supercamp. Hospitals where saving ~841 M.

Techs on the level when completed
Had 8 of the 10 Army Camp Boosts available.
All second column except last one which wasn't available, all Mines, all fourth column, Missing last 2 in fifth column , everything else except last Army Camp discount and 2 Mine discounts.

My Artifacts:
Boosts - Army Camp (epic), Mine, Bonus Money, Hopital, Draft (all rare)
Cache Boost - Amry (uncommon), Money (uncommon), Resources (common)
Discounts - Mercenary (rare), Army Camp (uncommon), Mine (uncommon), Hospital (common)
Speedy Crafters & Item Values (both rare)

AP
Increased Army Camp Production 140%
Increased Cache Money 30%
Joint Strike Max
Increase Smelters Speed 10%
Additional Mercenaries 30%
Statistics Max
Increased Idle Time 180 min
Increased Cache Resources 20%
Smelters/Crafters Visibility 3
Mercenary Discount 40%
Increased Draft Sizes 120%
Increase Crafters Speed 20%

Finished in 16 days, 14 hours plus 7 Time Warps used (still have 3 I haven't claimed yet).

After finishing this level I feel like I should have upgraded my Draft Boost to Epic instead of my Army Camp Boost. I put almost all my money into Army Camps, Hospitals and Digs until I had about 550/2277 territories left., then put everything into Mercenaries. Anybody else feel like Army Camp Boost is a little overrated? Increased Draft Sizes only goes up 5 AP per upgrade vs 10 AP for Increased Army Camp Production which makes me feel I should be putting AP into drafting over camps.

Any thoughts?

If anyone's wondering about my digs, I have 5 hours left on my current dig plus two 8 hrs, 22 hrs, 27 hrs, 33 hrs & 36 hrs. I started the level with 33 hour one from the previous level and had less than 15 minutes of non dig time throughout this level.
Is Army Camp Boost really the best Artifact?: 4/16/2021 22:21:27

Phoenix
Level 19
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IIRC, Time Warp affects digging. So, if you are waiting for a digging to finish and you have unclaimed Time Warps, use them to speed up your digging.
Is Army Camp Boost really the best Artifact?: 4/16/2021 22:44:43


PapaMarsh
Level 59
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I've long since quit idle. But what everyone seems to forget is that army camp production also drives drafts & caches. So if you're going based off of this:

Army Camp ~247.7 B
Mercenary ~567.9 B
Cache ~352.6 B
Drafting ~269.3 B


then it's important to remember that you don't know how much of that ~620B from caches and drafts was determined by the army camp boost you received from the artifact.
Is Army Camp Boost really the best Artifact?: 4/16/2021 23:53:17

Phoenix
Level 19
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Good point, though I find we concluded that caches are fixed (at least the ones on the map), but still, army camps influence drafting.
Is Army Camp Boost really the best Artifact?: 4/17/2021 03:12:35


asdfgh
Level 17
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Phoenix - I plan on using those time warps later to line up the dig sties for when I'll be awake

PapaMarsh - Yeah I know the draft is affected by Army Camps, but not as much as Mercenary or the fixed caches on the map. At the end I was getting about ~87 M ever 6 minutes from a normal draft, but getting ~3.7 B for multiple drafts after buying Mercenaries or getting large caches.

There's so many more ways to boost Army Camp Production: 11 Techs, money for camp increases, an Artifact, AP, plus watch the ad for 20% on top of all that compared to the Draft which has Just 2 techs, AP, and an Artifact. Yet the Draft still brings tn more armies.

I think both are important to put AP into and have the artifacts, but you might be better off putting more into the Drift side then Army Camp side.
Is Army Camp Boost really the best Artifact?: 4/17/2021 04:06:29


Master Jz 
Level 62
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I ran some numbers the other day based on the level I was working on. The top five epic artifacts for armies saved or earned over 16 hours were:
1. Quadruple Strike
2. Field Hospital
3. Triple Strike
4. Supercharge Army Camp
5. Army Camp Boost

Quadruple Strike was more than 3x Army Camp Boost at that point in my level. I had taken nearly all of the army camps and my army income wasn't changing much. I would use a Quadruple Strike Epic if I had one.

I generally need money more than I need army income. My personal top picks for Legendaries (in order) would probably be:
1. Speedy Crafters
2. Hospital Boost
3. Item Values
4. Mercenary Discount
5. Army Camp Boost

I usually finish levels with several billion in drafts unclaimed, but I still prefer the above artifacts.
Is Army Camp Boost really the best Artifact?: 4/17/2021 05:41:20

Parsifal
Level 61
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@asdfgh @Master Jz

I read actually all your comments here and I'm not convinced yet.
Running numbers on a specific level may give you one result. Krinid for example discovered a map where all his army camps gave him only 1% of the total army production. But is it the case with all 32 levels? no.
And if you take all the 32 levels, is Quadrouple Strike really better than Army Boost? I'd really want to see those calculations!
Is Army Camp Boost really the best Artifact?: 4/17/2021 05:54:52

Kcebnroh 
Level 53
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@Master Jz
I ran calculations for several levels and discovered my poor Army Camp Boost was giving me more armies in a 16 hour period than my uncommon Supercharge Army Camp. Now I admit it wasn't all the levels, and your artifacts are more upgraded than mine, but so far I have not run any calculations to refute my first finding. I am curious what method you used to find the Supercharge Army Camp a better option?

I agree about the money part. Depending on what level, and even what part of the level I'm on, I use my other 2 slots for the most profitable combination of:
*Territory Money Boost
*Bonus Money Boost
*Speedy Crafters
*Speedy Smelters (rarely, but occasionally I need it to keep my Crafter profit up)
*I'm still waiting to get the ore boost artifact...

Edited 4/17/2021 06:03:55
Is Army Camp Boost really the best Artifact?: 4/17/2021 06:34:58


Master Jz 
Level 62
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Supercharge Army Camp is highly dependent on the level and how many camps you have.

Income: 52,000 Armies/Second
Best Army Camp: 6,820 Armies/Second
AP & Tech Army Camp Modifiers (with Army Camp Boost unequipped): +285%

Epic Supercharge Army Camp: 120 Minutes
Armies Earned: 120 * 60 * 6820 * (20-1) = 932,976,000

Epic Army Camp Boost: 80%
52000/(1+2.85)*80% = 10,805 Additional armies per second
Multiply by 16 * 60 * 60 for armies gained in 16 hours: 622,379,221

Edited 4/17/2021 06:35:29
Is Army Camp Boost really the best Artifact?: 4/17/2021 06:41:59

Kcebnroh 
Level 53
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@asdfgh
I've noticed the drafts cap out at different amounts on the levels I've played so far. For example, I found on The Siege of Feldmere they capped out at 110 thousand, so after the second half of the game, all I got were 18-30 thousand boosts to help me capture the billion cost territories ( love how games roll the cap to 0 when you go over the top). As I got to higher levels I haven't run into that problem as often, but I've never seen the army camps capped at all.

I have so many artifacts to boost my money, but the Army Camp Boost is the only one I have to boost my armies while I sleep. Also, the artifacts seem to work ex post facto, so I'm easily able to slip my Draft Boost in last second and collect. Hey, just now I slipped my speedy crafter artifact in on a recipe that was at 85%, got 6 items, and when I put my money bonus back on, the new items production went down from 17% to 15%

Of course, in the situation of waiting at the end for the digs I replace the Army Camp Boost with another money boost (I'm currently playing Old Town and am about to be in your situation because I didn't start digging soon enough), but on the levels where you get all your digs and upgrades done with 40% of the territories left to conquer ( I ran into that on AD 1045: Roads of Silk and Iron), the Army Camp Boost, it seems to me at least, is the most important in the entire game.

I guess my question is, aside from passive artifacts you can use while actively playing, e.g. Draft Boost, Army Cache Boost, Hospital Boost, discounts, etc., what options are there besides the Supercharge Army Camp? Also, seeing it was the money you were short on and had an over abundance of troops anyway, why is the question about the Army Camp Boost, and not the money boosts?
Is Army Camp Boost really the best Artifact?: 4/17/2021 06:45:42

Parsifal
Level 61
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@Master Jz

a supercharge army camp on epic works for 120 min?? I read 32 min in the spreadsheet... is it outdated?
Is Army Camp Boost really the best Artifact?: 4/17/2021 09:17:21


Z 
Level 61
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There was a recent update to Actives, and the spreadsheet has incomplete info on them now.
Is Army Camp Boost really the best Artifact?: 4/17/2021 10:40:38


TBest 
Level 60
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a supercharge army camp on epic works for 120 min?? I read 32 min in the spreadsheet... is it outdated?

Legendary Supercharge Mine is 240 minutes, so 120 sounds right for Epic
Is Army Camp Boost really the best Artifact?: 4/17/2021 11:20:31


krinid 
Level 60
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As Z indicated, Actives got a boost lately. We're talking about that over here:
https://www.warzone.com/Forum/544013

But I am in the process of reevaluating all my Active artifacts which most of were useless before the buff (all but perhaps Inspire Mercs?), and now I'm finding that some are still lacklustre, but a few are actually quite useful (ie: worth the 16h cooldown).
Is Army Camp Boost really the best Artifact?: 4/17/2021 12:38:51

Parsifal
Level 61
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@Tbest

mine boost ist no army camp boost!
does anyone know for sure what are the updated numbers for the Supercharge Army Camp Artifact?
Is Army Camp Boost really the best Artifact?: 4/17/2021 12:44:23


krinid 
Level 60
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TBest referred to Supercharge Mine (same effect as the power of same name, but an Active artifact that applies to a single mine) for 20x benefit for 120 mins @ Epic, not Mine Boost which is Passive and applies to all mines but to a much smaller degree 7% @ Uncommon.
Is Army Camp Boost really the best Artifact?: 4/17/2021 13:28:18


Master Jz 
Level 62
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I have a poor or common of every active artifact. Assuming that they double with each upgrade, I have all of the numbers in my spreadsheet.
Is Army Camp Boost really the best Artifact?: 4/29/2021 15:27:44


asdfgh
Level 17
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Here's my Orbis Veteribus Notus stats

7 days 15 hours plus 4 time warps

Army Camp ~27.6 B
Mercenary ~60.5 B
Cache ~28.1 B
Drafting ~28.4 B

Increased Army Camp Production from 140% to 150%
Increased Draft Sizes from 120% to 150%
Max out mine discount, otherwise everything is the same as last time.

This was the first level in my last eight that I used all my Mercenaries.

So if I had kept my IACP and IDS the same as last time Army Camps would have been higher than my draft.
Had 5 Army Camp Tech (got the last one really late) and 1 Draft tech. No 50% cache boost tech.

So I think even more that if you're someone who collects drafts frequently or uses a ton of Mercenaries, than Mercenary Discount & Increased Draft Sizes should be the two Phase 2 upgrades that you should focus on. Plus making sure you have a Draft Boost Artifact to swap in at least after large caches and Mercenaries purchases.

Still have two days of digs before I start my last 35 hour one and start a new level.
Is Army Camp Boost really the best Artifact?: 4/29/2021 22:32:01


Master Jz 
Level 62
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The problem with Increase Draft Sizes is that it increases current drafts at the expense of future drafts. I actually think draft advancements/artifacts are better for players who draft less often because they help players "catch up" on drafts.
Is Army Camp Boost really the best Artifact?: 4/30/2021 00:22:25


krinid 
Level 60
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The problem with Increase Draft Sizes is that it increases current drafts at the expense of future drafts. I actually think draft advancements/artifacts are better for players who draft less often because they help players "catch up" on drafts.

Only Fizz knows for sure, but I don't think that's true. Even when the Draft pool is empty (exhausted after several consecutive drafts to arrive at the lowest possible value), the value is higher when the artifact is equipped. It wouldn't make any sense for the Artifact or the Advancement if all it did was make the actual individual drafts bigger without actual increasing the overall amount. Which doesn't mean that isn't the case ... but who knows, the math can be funky, and we don't know the formula, so there's no way to confirm it one way or the other.

Edited 4/30/2021 00:22:40
Is Army Camp Boost really the best Artifact?: 4/30/2021 14:25:04


Master Jz 
Level 62
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My drafts range from 16.8% to around 19% (depending on the level) when I'm fully caught up. I haven't spent any AP on Increased Drafts Sizes. I suspect that Increased Draft Sizes raises the ceiling, but not by that much.
Is Army Camp Boost really the best Artifact?: 5/3/2021 03:16:47


krinid 
Level 60
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19% Drafts seems pretty high ... is your math right? (;

Remember though that when you calculate % of army contribution that the real math is to include armies saved by hospitals & JS, b/c if you didn't save all those, you'd need to acquire them from army, mercs, caches or drafts.

So for example in my recent playthrough of Europe Huge, I have:

Finish stats: (Billions of troops)
Armies from army camps: 571.9452 8%
Mercs purchased: 1778.8 24%
Armies from caches: 927.6203 12%
Armies from drafts: 603.5924 8%
Armies saved from JS: 1255.9 17%
Armies saved from hospitals: 2296.0 31%
TOTAL 7433.8579 100%

At first glance Armies @ 571B looks reasonably high, ~15.5% of the incorrect total of 3882B if you don't count the hospitals & JS savings. But actually only 8% of the true total.
Is Army Camp Boost really the best Artifact?: 5/3/2021 04:06:31


Master Jz 
Level 62
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It was 17%-19% of armies earned (Camps + Mercs + Drafts + Caches), and it was only that high when my drafts were small. I didn't include Joint Strike or Hospitals because those values don't seem to have any impact on draft sizes. I didn't see a measurable improvement in the drafted/earned armies ratio even after unlocking all the drafting techs (when mostly caught up on drafts). Because of this, I didn't spend AP to increase draft sizes.

However, increasing draft sizes is beginning to look more appealing. This was my last level (rounded to the nearest billion):

Australia (3D14H)
Armies Leftover: 14B
Total Earned (according to the screenshot): 304B

Camps: 19B
Mercenaries: 199B
Drafting: 20B
Caches: 66B
Joint Strike: 89B
Hospitals: 308B

Drafts were less than 7% of my total armies earned and contributed around 3% of the armies to my level. This was after I did several max drafts toward the end. I left over 20B in potential drafts on the table. I've had levels that I've had to postpone several hours that I could have finished immediately if my drafts were caught up.

Edited 5/3/2021 04:17:18
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