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How to determine the order of your picks: 8/16/2018 13:16:03


Rheumakay
Level 53
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I used to play auto dist matches in the past, so I don't have much experience in picking the right territories in the best order.
I was looking for some threads to this topic but in the end they didn't help that much (because they mostly focused on Special examples). I know the basics - so there is no problem to find good spots on the map - but I don't really know how to pick them in the best order.

Lets assume you got 3 picks. Of course you are looking for 6 spots, but what will be the 1st, 2nd, …? I intentionally have no example of a map, cause I want to know the principles behind your choises.

What are your strategies? I need some inspiration :)
How to determine the order of your picks: 8/16/2018 13:34:39


Rogue NK
Level 59
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What map are you playing on?
How to determine the order of your picks: 8/16/2018 13:43:55


Rheumakay
Level 53
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95% of my games until now are:
earth (when playing with friends),
medium earth (QM Strategic 1v1) and
small earth (QM Small Earth 1 wasteland)

But I want to enlarge my repertoire :)
- hidden post by Bane
How to determine the order of your picks: 8/16/2018 14:10:11


TBest 
Level 60
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Let's start with the classical, Strat 1v1. This template is well covered, so stuff like this is a good read http://tinyurl.com/MH-strategy-guide.

cause I want to know the principles behind your choises.

Deepening on the distribution, picking tactics include, risky triple pick for a FTB and aggressive early play. A safe 1st pick, (impossible to counter) with a 2 and 3 pick for expansion. Then 4 and 5 in another expansion area, with 6 ALWAYS countering 4 and 5 (for 3 picks, 6 should almost always counter 4 and/or 5 )

There is also the 'blind' counter, where you counter with your 1st pick for example, where you hope that the other guy falls for your trap.

In short, you want to minimize risk while maximizing reward. 3-pick is very risky, and therefore often bad. A safe 1st pick, is often preferred, if possible. I haven't really talked about x2 picking an FTB, since they are often OP enough that you 'need' to pick them 1-2, leaving your 2-3 picks responsible for getting income fast.

Based on the maps you listed, try Battle Island (similar to Strat 1v1), Strat Greece (5 picks each) and French Brawl (very different) once you get to them on QM.

Edited 8/16/2018 14:12:41
How to determine the order of your picks: 8/16/2018 14:20:39


The Last Kiss
Level 55
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If you want to play some games I can play vs. you and then discuss the games afterwards to help try and spot errors in picking or play.

I can play most templates reasonably well, but am far better at strat 1v1 than at most others.
How to determine the order of your picks: 8/16/2018 14:22:28


Aura Guardian 
Level 62
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The picks you get in a 1v1 are based off of a simple ordering tecnique:

ABBAABBAA...

One player is assigned A, the other then is assigned B. This could be random or determined by a timer of who picks first if no luck cyclic.

So player A gets to pick first then. Since there are no conflicting warlords, Player a is guaranteed to get his first pick . Then player B gets to pick next. If one of player B's first pick is not the same as player A's he of course gets his first pick. However, if it is, warzone will not allocate the first pick and it will not strike it against them. This means although player B missed his first pick, warzone is still looking for the first "B" in the list above. It moves on and assigns the next pick of player B. Only if a player is successfully assigned a pick will warzone move on to the next letter in the cycle. After player B's first pick is assigned. Warzone moves onto the next letter-which is also B. This goes on until all picks are assigned.
How to determine the order of your picks: 8/16/2018 14:25:26


Aura Guardian 
Level 62
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In a 3 pick game, all possible pick combos are

123
124
125
126
134
135
136
145
234
235
236
How to determine the order of your picks: 8/16/2018 14:42:39


Rogue NK
Level 59
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For Modified Medium Earth, also known as QM Strategic 1v1, also known as MME, I find that it is important to have a lot of tools in your tool box.

The most important tool that you can learn is finishing a +4 bonus in two turns and then finishing a +4 and a +3 on the next turn.

This really breaks MME because the map is balanced around +5s and +3s and there are several very strong +4s with no double borders or 1 double or triple border

South America=No double borders or triple borders
Indonesia=No Double or triple borders
East China=One Triple border but you get winning positions vs South East Asia and East Russia
West Africa= One double border and one triple border but those are in Africa and Africa is not frequently picked.
West Russia= three double borders but is still great if Scandinavia is wasteland.

Example: https://www.warzone.com/MultiPlayer?GameID=16080245

Look at what 89th lap does in this game.

Both players can get 16 turn 3 income at deployment but because 89th knows about this method then he is able to get superior position.

It really doesn't matter if you go for a two +3s and a +4. You can be down by 2 or 3 income but if you have superior position then you are ahead. So I would order my picks in order of how safe they are taking into account possible counterpicks and double/triple borders while also trying to cover as much of the map as possible.

Edited 8/16/2018 14:46:19
How to determine the order of your picks: 8/16/2018 14:44:52


Buns157 
Level 68
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Just use your 1 2 to secure an area in a 1v1, don't put any other picks around them and pick whatever else looks pretty
How to determine the order of your picks: 8/17/2018 06:56:07


Rheumakay
Level 53
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@TBest
A safe 1st pick, (impossible to counter) with a 2 and 3 pick for expansion. Then 4 and 5 in another expansion area, with 6 ALWAYS countering 4 and 5 (for 3 picks, 6 should almost always counter 4 and/or 5 )

But here you have the problem, that your opponent may pick the same 1st and the you just got 50% to get your 1. If he gets it, you don't have any safe spot. 2-5 for expansion seems clear, also to split them in 2 groups. For the 6th I need some explanation… why "ALWAYS"

I think triple picks (or double picks for smaler Maps) to get a bigger bonus early are only a opportunity if there are more than 1 on the whole map - otherwise I would always suggest my opponent to counter them.

My problem with the other templates (as Battle Island, Strat Greece and French Brawl), they have no bottlenecks where you only have 1 or 2 borders - so I never played them even though I already got them in the list.


@The Last Kiss
Thank you - but before running into it I want to figure out some strats which I will try later. But when its this time I would love to try them with/against you :)


@[FCC] Aura Guardian
Your 1st post was already clear to me, but to see all possible pick combos is quite helpful.
It shows that you always get 4,5 or 6 (except you get all of your first 3 picks) - @TBest is this why you wrote it as "ALWAYS"?


@Rogue NK
Depending on your post - what do you think how many turns you should plan your expansion in advance?
The bonuses you mentioned with there bottleneck-territories are the reason I like the map(s) :)
In the example I totaly understand why they picked the territories they did - but also the picks of 89th have nothing in common with the strat TBest mentioned in the beginning for his picks 4-6


@Buns157
So you say its better to pick 1 and 2 close together?
How to determine the order of your picks: 8/17/2018 07:31:05


89thlap
Level 60
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There is no general rule how to order your picks, it is up to your own preferences. The guys above gave you good and well established guidelines. They are used very frequently and have been proven to work out decently most of the time. That does not mean that they are always the best solution and hence they should not be used always. And as you figured out already you can't use all of them simultaneously either.

My advice for you: It seems like you are interested in strategic gameplay. Read the strategy guide that TBest posted (it is worth it!), adapt these guidelines, use them as a tool to build up a solid understanding for the game. If you are looking for inspiration how other players order their picks take a look at the players from the top of a ladder (1v1, 2v2 / 3v3 if you are interested in that at some point, seasonals, MDL http://md-ladder.cloudapp.net/ -> lots of different templates).

If you want the ultimate advice, always check your picks carefully before committing them. Go through the different combinations that you might end up with and try to find out if there is any scenario that is unfavorable for you. If so, adjust your picks. Check again. Repeat...
How to determine the order of your picks: 8/17/2018 08:27:16


Rheumakay
Level 53
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There is no general rule how to order your picks, it is up to your own preferences.

Thats clear to me. This is why I wrote I want to know the principles behind your choises. Maybe there are variants that are mostly successful (as the ones that are mentioned) - but maybe there are also some you already tried, that were horrible in the end.


If you want the ultimate advice, always check your picks carefully before committing them. Go through the different combinations that you might end up with and try to find out if there is any scenario that is unfavorable for you. If so, adjust your picks. Check again. Repeat...

I guess this is a question of training… Mostly you got ~5min to pick and at the moment I am not in the postition to go through all of them^^

But thanks for your advices! Next thing I will do (when I got the time for it) is to study the strategy-guide. While skimming through it I think many of the things were already intuitive in my normal playstyle :)
How to determine the order of your picks: 8/17/2018 13:15:28


The Last Kiss
Level 55
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If you get your 6th pick, your opponent always has your 4th and 5th, at least on templates where each player has three starts, this is why TBest said your sixth pick should always counter your forth and fifth picks. I don't agree with his assessment though. Countering with a 6th pick can be useful, but there are other viable options. If you get 6th pick then you have full Intel, this means anything you didn't pick is empty, thus a 6th pick that can't be threatened by any of your previous picks, but can be countered by something you didn't pick is completely safe and not a gamble if picked sixth.
How to determine the order of your picks: 8/17/2018 20:05:49

[V.I.W] recruiting time! Join us !
Level 61
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For ME your picks should counter ftb combo and stb combo or at least give you Intel on enemy presence.

There are 2 'safe ' way to pick :

Spread your picks aiming to get a plus 3 a plus 4 and a plus 5 usually in America. This give you coverage in the map and flexibility.

Picks a plus3 and a stb plus 4. You get maximum income and if you meet enemy you have 2 or 3 more income forcing him on back foot .

To learn pickin sequence my advice if to look at MHGeorgie games.
He follows the basics very well
How to determine the order of your picks: 8/17/2018 20:10:09


Timinator • apex 
Level 64
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sometimes you might want to pick in a way to "trade" first pick for a nice 2+3 combo. in case you lose the "OP" first pick.
How to determine the order of your picks: 8/19/2018 22:10:00


Benjamin628 
Level 59
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ABBAABBA
How to determine the order of your picks: 8/19/2018 22:58:18

Nauzhror 
Level 56
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.

Edited 8/19/2018 23:14:20
How to determine the order of your picks: 8/20/2018 09:03:42


Rheumakay
Level 53
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Thats the kind of discussion I wanted to have :) There is no perfect way, but all pick orders have their pros and cons.
I think the way "The Last Kiss" sees the 6th pick is similar to my thoughts - it's a opportunity for a good pick if your opponend got all the other "good" picks of you.
Also the "trade" "Timinator • apex" mentioned sounds like a good option while picking the first 3 teritorries.

@[V.I.W] ilpeggiore:
So do you pick your spots all over the map or do you put 2 or 3 of them together to the same area? I don't realy get how this works "safe"
How to determine the order of your picks: 8/23/2018 15:47:21


The Last Kiss
Level 55
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I still think actually playing games, and then discussing picks on that specific board after the game is the best way to learn to pick well, as opposed to general rules to try and follow. That's not to say just looking at random top players games is ideal, I specifically mean the discussion with the player about what they picked and why, and what, if anything, was bad about your picks.
How to determine the order of your picks: 8/24/2018 12:46:11


Rheumakay
Level 53
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I guess in the end you are right...
Maybe we can start a new thread, where, let's say once per week, someone of the members posts a map and the rest says where they would pick (and why). Also all non members can post a link to a game and we can do the same. What do you think about it?


Nevertheless I like some theory and so I tried to put some of the variants that were mentioned in a table to analyse pros and cons.

I tried to form one scenario for each - TBest, Buns157 and The Last Kiss.
TBest Scenario 1 - Pick 1 in area A, Pick 2+3 in area B, Pick 4+5+6 in area C
The Last Kiss Scenario 2 - Same as Scenario 1, but Pick 6 in area D
Buns157 Scenario 3 - Pick 1+2 in area A, Pick 3+4+5+6 in area B,C,D,E

The table is according to the scheme Variant:Picks:Intel:Areas (Intel=Number of opponent picks you know about; Areas=capital letter means you get more than 1 spot in the area , lower case you get 1 spot , - nothing in this area)

Scenario 1
1 : 1 2 3 : 0 : a B -
2 : 1 2 4 : 1 : a b c
3 : 1 2 5 : 2 : a b c
4 : 1 2 6 : 3 : a b c
5 : 1 3 4 : 1 : a b c
6 : 1 3 5 : 2 : a b c
7 : 1 3 6 : 3 : a b c
8 : 1 4 5 : 2 : a - C
9 : 2 3 4 : 1 : - B c
10 : 2 3 5 : 2 : - B c
11 : 2 3 6 : 3 : - B c

With this picking strategy you always get either 1 pick in each area (Var 2-7) or 2 of them with one double pick (Var 1, 8-11).
--> might be good if there are 3 similar "good" areas

Scenario 2
1 : 1 2 3 : 0 : a B - -
2 : 1 2 4 : 1 : a b c -
3 : 1 2 5 : 2 : a b c -
4 : 1 2 6 : 3 : a b - d
5 : 1 3 4 : 1 : a b c -
6 : 1 3 5 : 2 : a b c -
7 : 1 3 6 : 3 : a b - d
8 : 1 4 5 : 2 : a - C -
9 : 2 3 4 : 1 : - B c -
10 : 2 3 5 : 2 : - B c -
11 : 2 3 6 : 3 : - B - d

Of course this one is similar to Scenario 1.
Advantage: When you get area D you know all spots of your opponent - so consider this while picking the 6. Also you will always get at least 1 spot in area B when you get the 6
Disadvantage: If your 4 areas are far apart you have nothing next to the double pick of your opponent (your 4+5)
--> might be good when the areas are not that far apart and so you can get a area (D) out of range

Scenario 3
1 : 1 2 3 : 0 : A b - - -
2 : 1 2 4 : 1 : A - c - -
3 : 1 2 5 : 2 : A - - d -
4 : 1 2 6 : 3 : A - - - e
5 : 1 3 4 : 1 : a b c - -
6 : 1 3 5 : 2 : a b - d -
7 : 1 3 6 : 3 : a b - - e
8 : 1 4 5 : 2 : a - c d -
9 : 2 3 4 : 1 : a b c - -
10 : 2 3 5 : 2 : a b - d -
11 : 2 3 6 : 3 : a b - - e

Advantage: You always get a pick in area A
Disadvantage: It's quite random where the other pick(s) is/are
--> might be good if there are many good spots and 1 supperior spot on the map


Feel free to add some thoughts about this :)
How to determine the order of your picks: 8/24/2018 19:27:27


The Last Kiss
Level 55
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Having multiple people chime in and explain their picks can certainly be beneficial, but personally, I find it easier to visualize how good a set of picks are by actually seeing how they were put into use in an actual game.
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