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Your opinion on abortion: 11/6/2017 01:15:18


Warsaw Pact
Level 56
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Is it justified?

I do not think abortion is justified.

Id like to hear from You.
Your opinion on abortion: 11/6/2017 02:14:21


knyte 
Level 58
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Your opinion on abortion: 11/6/2017 02:25:09


Wulfhere
Level 47
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high abortion rate is always a sign of decline
Your opinion on abortion: 11/6/2017 06:56:31


Japanball
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Bad, but I don't support restricting people's rights on it.
Your opinion on abortion: 11/6/2017 17:22:38


Clint Eastwood 
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Abortion should only be legal in the situation that it endangers the mother's life. Aside from that, it should be 100% restricted. Don't want/can't have a baby? Just give it up for adoption, or at the very least leave it on the doorstep of a police department or something. No need to abort it.
Your opinion on abortion: 11/6/2017 17:29:56


Japanball
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There is already an adoption problem. Way too many children need adobtion.
Your opinion on abortion: 11/6/2017 17:30:08


Japanball
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And you or for gay adoption, right?
Your opinion on abortion: 11/6/2017 17:42:25


Empire of Kilos
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Overpopulation is a problem, but the answer isn't killing babies.
Your opinion on abortion: 11/6/2017 17:43:10


Japanball
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Who do we kill?
Your opinion on abortion: 11/6/2017 17:55:11


Wulfhere
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The overpopulation meme is hilarious. And the people who usually talk about overpopulation are quick to blame the West when in reality it's the third world that's having too many children. Yet they would be opposed to killing third worlders or restricting their rights to have large families.
Your opinion on abortion: 11/6/2017 17:57:39


the terrorists
Level 11
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If you force other people to abide by your own metaphysical/religious beliefs, the terrorists win.
Your opinion on abortion: 11/6/2017 18:02:47

strongkillaz
Level 47
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the world is fucking retarded now we have men being women and they're using the excuse of expressing themselves
and no dont kill a fucking baby because they have no one to defend them, you dont want the baby? too fucking late you
werent wise and got pregnant put them up 4 adoption you stupid women
Your opinion on abortion: 11/6/2017 18:04:19


kyte
Level 12
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Pregnancy is punishment for sex.
Your opinion on abortion: 11/6/2017 18:40:45


OxTheAutist 
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The overpopulation meme is hilarious. And the people who usually talk about overpopulation are quick to blame the West when in reality it's the third world that's having too many children.
care to elaborate? i don't get this argument
Your opinion on abortion: 11/6/2017 18:44:04


Japanball
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^^^And they live a horrible life
^^Abstinence doesn't work

Edited 11/6/2017 18:44:12
Your opinion on abortion: 11/6/2017 22:54:36


Padraig
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The overpopulation meme is hilarious. And the people who usually talk about overpopulation are quick to blame the West when in reality it's the third world that's having too many children.

care to elaborate? i don't get this argument

I agree with Wulfhere, insofar as the West is not adding billions to the world population.

As to what is meant by "too many," should we talk of Malthus?

To speak in gross generalities, the West has stopped growing and the remainder of the world continues to grow.

The late Hans Rosling, who was a demographer, claimed that the world's population will peak at something like 10 billion persons. There are those who claimed that the man had an overly optimistic view of the future. His view was that a future, where the whole world is lifted out of poverty and was able to enjoy a decent life, was probable. My own view is that this is possible. Unfortunately other far darker futures are also achievable. As the saying goes, the road to hell is broad and easy.

Hans Rosling, Population Growth and Climate Change:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=14&v=SxbprYyjyyU

The Hans Rosling link is a quick 3 minute 18 second talk.
Your opinion on abortion: 11/6/2017 23:00:47


knyte 
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I don't think most people who choose to abort do so because of overpopulation, but one less baby in the US isn't all that different from one less baby in India or Nigeria if you're concerned primarily with global overpopulation and planetary carrying capacity. Iceland isn't particularly responsible for anthropogenic climate chance but that doesn't make burning a ton of coal there any less impactful than burning a ton of coal in the US or China w.r.t. the total amount of pollutants released into the Earth's atmosphere.

I think one issue y'all might be skipping over is the difference between forcing people not to have babies and letting people choose. People can be in favor of allowing women to terminate pregnancies in the US without also supporting a one-child policy in developing countries. Wulfhere might not be a fan of choice or individual rights, but those do factor heavily into a lot of people's ethical logic. (I'd like to sidestep the argument about the choice of a fetus to live or to die, since I'm only chiming in to cover that one specific overpopulation point y'all seem to be having a little bit of trouble working with).
Your opinion on abortion: 11/6/2017 23:10:53


Padraig
Level 38
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It would have been better if the advocates of legal abortion had achieved their goals in the US by referendum rather than by the action of the supreme court. The very question has a baleful influence on politics in the United States.

Robert Malthus said:

That the increase of population is necessarily limited by the means of subsistence,
That population does invariably increase when the means of subsistence increase, and,
That the superior power of population is repressed by moral restraint, vice and misery.


Abortion is one of Malthus' vices. In the minds of his contemporaries contraception would also be one of those things which represses population growth and is a vice. Absent moral restraint I prefer contraception as the lesser vice.

If I could re-animate the dead Malthus I would ask him what policy was achievable.

Edited 11/6/2017 23:13:42
Your opinion on abortion: 11/6/2017 23:21:43


Padraig
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China tried enforcing lower birth rates by means of the coercive power of the state, and it worked.

"Then they found that their neighbor (Thailand) reduced birthrates faster without coercion. Thailand simply provided sex education, free or cheap voluntary contraception and the rest sorted itself out."

As a general rule, countries with high rates of female literacy have smaller families. The correlation is amazingly strong.

Edited 11/6/2017 23:27:59
Your opinion on abortion: 11/6/2017 23:29:12


OxTheAutist 
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I agree with Wulfhere, insofar as the West is not adding billions to the world population.
Do you agree with him beyond that, or are you just taking the liberty to state a fact for the fun of it?

Read between the lines of what he's saying.
Your opinion on abortion: 11/6/2017 23:31:19


Wulfhere
Level 47
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>having a sustainable human population

Wait for the Western resurgence and then the end of Western civilization before you go talking about muh sustainability.

Don't worry the barbarians that are left behind when our culture falls will not have the technical means to support billions of people.
Your opinion on abortion: 11/6/2017 23:37:55


Wulfhere
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Regulating the human population and sustainability is so decadent and ugly I should not even need to elaborate further. Most people have a sort of intuition of disgust when they talk about things like abortion and preventing "unneeded children." Of course humans transcend a mere animal plane as highly creative and rational beings. We should keep our environment in good condition for efficiency purposes but the neo-Malthusian celebration and worship of cutting down the human population is unhealthy. Their soulless doctrine always has a pathogenic effect on society; the correlation between socioeconomic stagnation and declining birth rate is very apparent.

Edited 11/6/2017 23:43:11
Your opinion on abortion: 11/6/2017 23:51:00


The Cruelest
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I didn't used to care but this Academic article changed my mind.

https://www.princeton.edu/~prolife/articles/wdhbb.html
Your opinion on abortion: 11/7/2017 01:36:35


Padraig
Level 38
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Do you agree with him beyond that...

Well, Ox, not in the sense that you mean.
Your opinion on abortion: 11/7/2017 02:36:23

Nauzhror 
Level 56
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No one who wants to abort their child is going to make a good parent if forced to raise their child.

If you don't want to have children and are pregnant, I'd rather see you abort or put the child up for adoption than raise it halfheartedly.

I think adoption is a better choice on paper, but for it to actually be better they need to make it much more streamlined, and much easier to adopt.

It's absurd that there's such strict standards to adopt, when there's no such standards required to obtain custody of your own children upon giving birth to them.
Your opinion on abortion: 11/7/2017 02:49:16


Major General Smedley Butler
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care to elaborate? i don't get this argument

Germany isn't going to starve anytime soon, but Nigeria probably is. Why? One has a fairly stable population and the means to feed it. The other doesn't. So if you care for high populations and famine, don't just take away folk (don't do it in general) or improve agriculture in the good one and expect it to help.
Your opinion on abortion: 11/7/2017 04:06:39


Wulfhere
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Do you agree with him beyond that...

Well, Ox, not in the sense that you mean.


We're actually all Western Chauvinists for different reasons it seems.
Your opinion on abortion: 11/7/2017 04:09:52


Wulfhere
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Overflowing orphanages and foster care homes are an alternate set of symptoms to social decay. They replace abortion but contribute even more to a general psychosis.

Throwing the abortion-seeking mother in prison is also a terrible move since maternal stress hormones lead to children with a host of psychological problems.

Ultimately I want a traditional Western society with strong values.. abortion is a sign of decline but a "War on abortion" of sorts would just be disastrous. Reverse the underlying social decay before trying to suppress the symptoms.

Edited 11/7/2017 04:15:42
Your opinion on abortion: 11/7/2017 21:46:02


[WOLF] The Conservative
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Pretty simple for me. Safe, legal, and extremely rare. That's how it should be.
Your opinion on abortion: 11/8/2017 00:45:12


Wulfhere
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That's Conservative talking about his sex life
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