I have more personal interest about Spain for now, as I am from a lace close to Spain. If Spain collapses it will have more impact in Europe than for example Canada,

I don't think either of those countries have an economy in immediate danger of collapsing. Sure, Spain's economy isn't at it's most productive right now, but it's not in a situation as bad as Greece is.

so I guess it is important for us Europeans to care a little bit at least about the future of this country.

Correction: it is important for the Eurozone

Edited 12/21/2015 22:29:04

that's funny your talk about Turkey, I always thought Spain and Turkey looked much alike historically speaking, knowning both a kind of religious reversal (one muslim to christian the other christian to muslim), both being major historical nations, and most advanced (see Al Andalus and Byzantium) that later colonized or conquered huge parts of the world (america for one, the middle east and east europe for the other one), both having big minorities (kurds or basques) struggling for independence, and the list goes on.

Koala there's this thing called being so smart that you just don't give a fuck anymore and you just say what you want. But in this case, I'm just laying down the cold-hard facts :

SPAIN IS IRRELEVANT

Ok Genghis, then I am ready to listen to your own arguments about how Spain is irrelevant: the fact that you know nothing about this country does not allow you to make such minimalist, infinitesimal and meaningless comment about it. I expect better from you.

Clement if you think Britain is safe with the Eurozone collapsing, then you are dreaming my dear British comrade. Spain is ok for now but for how long this is the question, Spain is 5 times bigger compared to Greece, so if something similar happens again we are all doomed, and not only Europe.

DETECTIVE GENGHIS IS ON THE SCENE!

Alright, so, Spain is into debt and EU. As we all know, EU and debt mix together like wine and buffalo wild wings (actually I've tried it before and it's only mildly disgusting). Spain is also into matador/bull fights. Keep these 2 things in mind

Spain's entire economy is based on bullfighting and tourism. That much I know. However, all the people go to Spain expecting Mexicans who beg for money. Instead, they get white people begging for money. Nobody want to give money to the Greedy Whitey!

Thus, tourism is dwindling at an exponential rate! Just look at this graph!



Thus, they are not getting those juicy, plump service-sector jobs. So, everybody is going broke and losing jobs. 33% of the nation is already unemployed, this is projected to be 69% by the 25th. Just look at these statistics!


So, what did we learn? Let's find out!

Case File: Spain! Should it be Relevant?
Evidence : 1 graph, 1 statistic. Spain's economy is built on Tourism and Bullfighting
Conclusion : Spanish economy is down the tube.
Verdict : Spain is now irrelevant.

*hops in cop car, drives away*

lol Genghis that was funny at least.

Portugal and Italy are in the same boat as Spain...if any one of them collapse and leave the EU it would be 10X more (just a hyperbole not an actual statistic) dangerous that Greece leaving. That being said, this should not discourage a real debate about whether countries should be in the EU at all. Greece was over-dramatized because it was the first EU country to be near collapse and leave the Euro, thus is would set a precedent for other countries.

Clement if you think Britain is safe with the Eurozone collapsing, then you are dreaming my dear British comrade. Spain is ok for now but for how long this is the question, Spain is 5 times bigger compared to Greece, so if something similar happens again we are all doomed, and not only Europe.

Nor am I claiming that we could be 100% fine. However, the Eurozone has a lot more to worry about from Spain's economy, which probably won't collapse. I'm far for concerned about what effect gullible idiots believing UKIP's propaganda will have on the British economy than I am about what effect Spain might cause.

To be fair we shouldn't worry about UKIP as they got what 1 seat in parliament. They only prosper in poverty stricken places such as Greater Manchester in places such as Rochdale and Oldham because wouldn't you know it many racist and lower class voters reside there.

@SirSalty, their impact on parliament isn't something I'm worried about, but their terrible reasons for wanting to leave the EU might persuade a significant proportion of morons to vote to leave the EU in the upcoming referendum.

UKIP is bad, but still better compared to FN...

Very true but they've lost many supporters, contrary to my previous statement UKIP was abousletly crushed in the local elections in the Oldham and Royton area as Labour won with 23,000 compared to UKIP's 8000

I would rank Spain as the 11th most important European state
1-Germany
2-UK
3-France
4-Ukraine
5-Poland
6-Sweden
7-Italy
8-Switzerland
9-Netherlands
10-Austria
11-Spain

1 Germany
2 United Kingdom
3 France
4 Italy
5 Russia
6 Spain
7 Netherlands
8 Switzerland
9 Sweden
10 Poland
11 Belgium
12 Norway
13 Austria

Edited 12/22/2015 01:36:22

What spain has:

Tourism

What catalonya will have if they become independent:

Tourism

What spain will have if catalonya becomes independent:

Tourism

All their income is basically:

Tourism

In other words, they are heavily dependant on other countries having interest in visiting them AND any danage on their neighbors' economy will be trouble for them as they will have no tourists.

Basically, Spain has to grow some goddamn industry. Anti-Austerity is just going to f*ck them even further. Who would want to visit the endebted shithole that is Spain?

Mister Ki - ITALY 7TH??!!!


That's ridiculous.

Everyone should stop the UKIP hate-mongering. Its totally undeserved. They're not xenophobic. They just want lower legal immigration levels. That's called being rational and understanding you can't import billions of poor people onto a small island of a country.

Why would you want lower lethal immigrants? Uk is going to have population issues very soon so they need some pop now

They don't need the pop if all they're importing is low skill immigrants who depend on the government dole. The direction of future economic growth requires high skilled workers in STEM and administration. What european countries such as France and Britain need is to place favored preference status for people with advanced skills in fields where they have a shortage. That's how my father managed to cut the immigration process to the US by half. Even better would be to offer incentives to accelerate the brain drain from other countries. Globalism doesn't mean international competition between countries died. Mercantilism is alive, except governments aren't trying to accumulate wealth...they should be trying to accumulate "invisible assets" such as the best talents in each field. This is how nations become strong and maintain power. The minute top professionals in India, Japan, Korea, China, and the developing world decide to stay in their countries is the minute Europe and America start to decline.

The potential labor shortage you guys are freaking out about can be solved simply with larger quotas for guest worker programs. However, guest workers shouldn't be offered a path to citizenship since they send most of that money back to their native country to help their family anyway. The need for workers shouldn't be made at the expense of people who currently live there.

Edited 12/22/2015 02:48:29

Germany 1st!!! yes masterKL