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"Past Games" officially announced to be repaired!!: 7/10/2015 06:26:50


Kain
Level 57
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Fizzer (WarLight Creator, WarLight) responded · July 10, 2015 2015

I agree sorting by ended date would be a great option, and probably even the best default. Thanks for the suggestion.



http://warlight.uservoice.com/forums/77051-warlight-features/suggestions/8699689-adding-new-filters-to-past-games-section




hhhhhhhhuuuuuuuuuuuuurrrrrrrrrreeeeeeeeeeeeeeeyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy



great thx for all your help guys/girls and comments and votes. We did it!!! and of course thx for Fizzer for such rapid response:)

Edited 7/10/2015 09:12:48
"Past Games" officially announced to be repaired!!: 7/10/2015 06:35:26


l4v.r0v 
Level 59
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Lol it's the one thing Fizzer's actually added to his plans. Everything else got a bullshit response. I found the "clans" one to be the funniest- even though clans are stored using a unique ClanID, Fizzer claims that clan names are their "identity" and shouldn't be allowed to change. Y'know, just like players can't change their names because player names are their identity. Pretty clear where Fizzer's priorities lie.
"Past Games" officially announced to be repaired!!: 7/10/2015 08:00:34


skunk940 
Level 60
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Quite a few ideas on Uservoice have now had acknowledgement of happening/something similar happening.
"Past Games" officially announced to be repaired!!: 7/10/2015 08:24:25


DanWL 
Level 63
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Quite a few ideas on Uservoice have now had acknowledgement of happening/something similar happening.

For example, when I looked at my e-mail, "Vacations by number of days instead of number of vacations" has been updated, but "Anonymous Games" were declined.
"Past Games" officially announced to be repaired!!: 7/10/2015 08:28:59


Widzisz • apex 
Level 61
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Everything else got a bullshit response.

Um. Wouldn't call it bs, you can see that they were in fact well thought through.
"Past Games" officially announced to be repaired!!: 7/10/2015 09:12:04


Kain
Level 57
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Wouldnt call them "bulshit" neither
"Past Games" officially announced to be repaired!!: 7/10/2015 11:27:33


Ƨillynamenace
Level 59
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do you think this can also be fixed:

https://www.warlight.net/Forum/91531-settings-highlight-split

it's a simple thing for the Admin, nothing bothersome.
"Past Games" officially announced to be repaired!!: 7/10/2015 11:39:53


l4v.r0v 
Level 59
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Most of them were just the "immediate roadmap" response. I wouldn't call copypasting the oldest excuse a developer has everywhere a "well-thought-out" response.
"Past Games" officially announced to be repaired!!: 7/10/2015 15:01:15


ps 
Level 61
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was disappointed by the rejection of some of the ideas with huge number of votes in favor like the anonymous games and the mega bonuses income sharing.

Edited 7/10/2015 15:02:12
"Past Games" officially announced to be repaired!!: 7/10/2015 15:14:51


l4v.r0v 
Level 59
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^ Agreed. Some of them are even absurdly trivial to implement unless Fizzer's codebase is atrociously organized. Like tracking vacations by # of days instead of # of vacations.

I mean, given some of the errors I get on the API, it does look like there's a lot of glitches in there (then again, he doesn't really seem to give a shit about the public API or about encouraging development on his game). However, the GitHub code he posted for the CLOT framework isn't very confusing to work with/edit, so unless the WL codebase itself is significantly worse... I just don't get why he's not making these incredibly small changes that would make the userbase incredibly happy. :(

But fuck it. I bought a membership in the hopes that Fizzer doesn't just keep letting down the user community. Maybe my small contribution will actually count for something.

Edited 7/10/2015 15:15:43
"Past Games" officially announced to be repaired!!: 7/10/2015 15:27:28


Kain
Level 57
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Perhaps F has just started repairing WL - take into consideration that my project was different form most of the others in they way that it didnt offered anything new, instead it was only pointing that part of WL is broken and needs fixing (Past Games). Thus maybe it is the good time to sort such things out and make a list of few (maybe more then few) small, and rather easy to implement, issues and present them as the new, common project. If this gather enough audience it may succed.. ?
"Past Games" officially announced to be repaired!!: 7/10/2015 15:33:19


l4v.r0v 
Level 59
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Lots of others were pointing out that Warlight was broken.

Likely trivial and quick fixes I remember form uservoice:

- enable clan name changes

- track vacations by # of days, not # of vacations

Likely trivial but not entirely quick fixes I remember:

- your suggestion

- add a category for clan management that has invite permissions, nothing else

- partial history

- internationalization (using Google Translate or similar services)

Either Fizzer has some real life issues, something super secret (and hopefully great) in the works... or he's just seriously neglecting Warlight.

Edited 7/10/2015 15:33:46
"Past Games" officially announced to be repaired!!: 7/10/2015 15:33:24


Kenny • apex 
Level 59
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Knyte, did Fizzer piss in your cheerios or something? The hostility man. Eat a snickers or something.
"Past Games" officially announced to be repaired!!: 7/10/2015 15:35:05


l4v.r0v 
Level 59
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I'm not being hostile; I'm just very disappointed in the level of development this game has. At the very least, Fizzer could just expand the APIs very slightly and allow other developers to improve the game if he's not willing to spend the effort.
"Past Games" officially announced to be repaired!!: 7/10/2015 15:40:53


Kenny • apex 
Level 59
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It's 1 person doing the development of the game. He's doing things that aren't suggested all the time. Chill out. I've been here for a couple years now and nothing has changed about his pace or priorities lol. The things you call trivial are probably not as easy as you think. Are you looking at the coding for Warlight right now in order to know fully well how trivial or not it is.

Yes, you're being hostile.


Either Fizzer has some real life issues, something super secret (and hopefully great) in the works... or he's just seriously neglecting Warlight.


Is a hostile comment. Fizzer has made Warlight his main priority in his life. What's being seriously neglected? He's made consistently good updates to the game since I first arrived here. They just may not be the updates you WANT. (though we can pretend the bomb card never happened)
"Past Games" officially announced to be repaired!!: 7/10/2015 16:01:25


l4v.r0v 
Level 59
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It's 1 person doing the development of the game.


And that's exactly the problem. There's a potentially sizable developer community on Warlight- just look at the activity of some people when it comes to CLOTs, the participants in the Warlight AI challenges, and the people doing analysis.

This wouldn't be easy (would probably take a week or so, maybe 2-3 or a whole month if done extensibly and thoroughly) but what I think Fizzer could do to completely solve the limitations that inhibit Warlight's development would be to open up its APIs (and, of course, create or publish usage caps; right now, based on the lack of limits on calling, it's very evident that Fizzer doesn't expect those APIs to actually be used and didn't design them with that expectation in mind). Here's a simple roadmap:

Create Game API: fix the parser (looks like there's a formatting error that throws an exception for perfectly-formatted JSON resulting from widely-used and nearly bug-free Python libraries; I figured it out a month ago or so- before I had API access, so I forgot about it but I'll edit it in when I find the exact bug again), remove the absolute restriction that keeps you from inviting players (replace with a cap of some sort) as it renders large-scale automation near-impossible especially when things like Order Priority/Delay require L43 and aren't accessible to most players.

Query Game API: remove restriction on querying games that you weren't a part of (outside tournament/ladder games) as it inhibits analysis; at the very least, make it possible for you to analyze games you hosted but didn't participate in... or let the host decline their own game (the easiest janky workaround here)

Game ID feed API: allow for reverse sorting (really cosmetic but still pretty solid), restrictions like "didn't end in a boot" or "not expired", etc.

Clan interface: make the APIs public; Fizzer says that fixing the clan management system isn't in his "immediate roadmap." That's understandable- it's just like reddit, for example, not fixing their moderation tools for years. However, the difference is that reddit opened up its moderation tools API and along came Toolbox- something the mod community has been fine with using for years; it's kept us from complaining too much about the shitty vanilla modtools, at least until the Paocalypse happened. Right now, I'm actually working on fixing this after reading Fizzer's response but frankly I suck at reverse engineering private APIs when anything more complex than simple HTTP requests is involved; if he made this public, give it a month and you have a much more robust clan management interface available as a browser extension or script.

Tournament interface: allow for tournament creation and inviting to be automated; this would allow, for example, the widely-operating leagues (Clan League, Promotion/Relegation League/etc.) to be automated without using the CLOT framework. Also allow for tournament querying beyond the Game ID feed API- for example, getting win/loss directly, getting final ranks, getting invites/declines, getting clans/etc.

These are not entirely without their pitfalls and, of course, would have to be done carefully. But just these four would do a whole lot. I understand that it's an investment to overhaul the APIs, but it's got dividends that easily eclipse that of virtually any other Warlight change that's just as simple or simpler to implement.

The things you call trivial are probably not as easy as you think.


They would still be trivial if the codebase is written in Java (which I suspect it is based on the errors that occur on some API calls being typical ones from certain Java libraries) and sensibly organized (which I suspect it is, because Fizzer clearly knows how to code based on his CLOT repository on GitHub).

Are you looking at the coding for Warlight right now in order to know fully well how trivial or not it is.


No, because Fizzer hasn't open-sourced the codebase or made it remotely easy for a developer to work on. Most of the public APIs are much, much more restrictive than WL's private APIs, sometimes to the point of being near-useless outside some very specific situations (I'm talking about the Create Game API outside CLOTs, for example). If Fizzer open-sourced Warlight, not only would it allow for quicker bug-detection but it would also basically lead to a massive amount of development on his platform and almost certainly make it last longer.

To be honest, if I had access to Warlight's codebase, I'd easily do the changes I'm suggesting without charge even though I've got a ton of other obligations to worry about, just because they're almost certainly not that hard. I'm betting that they're easier than what a decent 17-year-old programmer would implement in 24 hours at a hackathon.

What's being seriously neglected? He's made consistently good updates to the game since I first arrived here. They just may not be the updates you WANT.


I apologize if I'm coming off as hostile, but I genuinely think those are the three possibilities. I understand that Fizzer clearly updates this game regularly, but I simply don't understand why he adds things like the Bomb Card over the vast majority of sensible, simple user suggestions.

So what I'm saying is that there are people that would easily implement user suggestions for free if Fizzer just made Warlight developer-friendly. We wouldn't have to go through this uservoice "immediate roadmap" situation if people other than Fizzer just had the ability to actually do something to make Warlight better without expending the effort of reverse-engineering Warlight's APIs and then worrying about Fizzer finding out/caring that they did so.

Edited 7/10/2015 16:07:26
"Past Games" officially announced to be repaired!!: 7/10/2015 16:16:54


l4v.r0v 
Level 59
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And if you're skeptical about whether developers would actually leverage an improved public API:

if it can happen to Yo of all things... it can happen to Warlight.
"Past Games" officially announced to be repaired!!: 7/10/2015 16:44:58


Fleecemaster 
Level 59
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It's not gonna happen knyte, Warlight is not going to become an open source-type game, or anything near it. The developer has zero requirements to do anything to the game, he could shut it down today if he wanted and you would have no rights to it.

Saying that, at least I now know why the Kongregate game is so underdeveloped now. We're just going to have to accept it though. To be honest I was happy enough when Warlight came out as multiplayer, we should be happy enough that we have that...
"Past Games" officially announced to be repaired!!: 7/10/2015 16:51:57


l4v.r0v 
Level 59
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^ Obviously, we have no claim to Fizzer's time. But that doesn't mean we should settle for less because raising our standards creates an incentive for Fizzer to do more as long as it's humanly possible.

If you have ads enabled, you are the "product" that pays for site maintenance- if you play coin games, doubly so. If your company loses its product, it collapses, so you always want to have friendly relations with the product.

Then again, I can't tell if WL is making any money right now. If it's just Fizzer's side project, then yeah the users have zero power. But if it's any more than that, then the users' desires matter.

Edited 7/10/2015 16:54:54
"Past Games" officially announced to be repaired!!: 7/10/2015 17:01:36


Kenny • apex 
Level 59
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I guess that's the difference between you and I. I don't care that only 1 person is working on this game. It's Fizzer's intellectual property, if he wants to open-source the game, he can. If he doesn't, then just deal with it. I don't think he has to open-source the game to improve it. I think if he wants more developers, he'll hire more developers. That's his decision. It's his game and you have to respect that.

That's why I don't think you're truly improving the game by doing this all publicly, you come off as whiny and hostile. If you want the game to be open source, suggest it, mail fizzer, get a petition going. Openly whining about features that you have solutions for isn't progression.

I truly do think you care about this game, but you're not coming off the right way. :P
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