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maps where each territory has its own bonus: 3/21/2012 16:46:48


{rp} General Mac 
Level 53
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Hello kind and wonderfull Warlight community :D

Does anyone know if any maps are set up so there are bonuses for a each SINGLE territory i.e not a collection of territories

i had a quick look but it doesnt look like there are any :(

I want to try and test something out for my Zombie Survival games and the way the zombies (AIs) react to different situations

im hoping that the AI would be more likely to take down a Blockade if the single territory was a bonus

hope that makes sense.
maps where each territory has its own bonus: 3/21/2012 17:09:46

The Duke of Ben 
Level 55
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From my understanding of the problem, that won't fix it. The AI does an analysis of whether it's worth attacking the neutral (blockaded) territory, based on what bonus it completes. Unless you made each individual bonus worth a lot, the AI will react the same as it does now.
maps where each territory has its own bonus: 3/21/2012 17:14:14


{rp} General Mac 
Level 53
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i was afraid of that :(
maps where each territory has its own bonus: 3/21/2012 17:45:26

Fizzer 
Level 58

Warzone Creator
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maps where each territory has its own bonus: 3/21/2012 17:56:15

RvW 
Level 46
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There actually are a few maps with meets your requirements, all three by [{CZ-SK} Vondy](http://warlight.net/Profile.aspx?p=999227065):

- [Czech republic - small](http://warlight.net/Map.aspx?ID=4791)
- [Slovakia - small](http://warlight.net/Map.aspx?ID=4800)
- [Czechoslovakia - small](http://warlight.net/Map.aspx?ID=4801)


Also, there's "[Duel](http://warlight.net/Map.aspx?ID=215)", "[Truel](http://warlight.net/Map.aspx?ID=4985)" and "[Quadruel](http://warlight.net/Map.aspx?ID=4989)", but those are probably too small for your testing.

---

I cannot proof, but have a very distinct suspicion, the AI ignores bonuses with a negative value. Not "ignore" as in "doesn't try to conquer", but as in "entirely oblivious to the fact it should NOT try to conquer them".
What *might* work (for now, it's extremely likely to break if/when Fizzer gets around to updating the AI) is to make a map specifically for this purpose. You'd give every territory (or small cluster of territories) **two** bonuses, which exactly coincide; they consist of exactly the same territories. Then you give one of those bonuses +1000 and the other -1000.
maps where each territory has its own bonus: 3/21/2012 18:06:22


{rp} General Mac 
Level 53
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Thanks Fizzer and RvW

Hmm thats an interesting thought. Assuming that you are right and the AI does ignore negative bonuses i think that could work

Thanks, i appreciated your help on this

now i just need time to create a map to test this on :)
maps where each territory has its own bonus: 3/21/2012 18:26:08

RvW 
Level 46
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Hmm, it just did some tests and it looks like I was wrong.

- If a territory is controlled by neutral ...
- ... and it is part of a negative bonus, the AI will simply ignore it.
- ... and it is part of multiple bonuses, with the sum of those bonuses negative, the AI will simply ignore it.
- If a territory is controlled by an opponent then the AI will attack it, completely ignoring the fact it will complete a negative bonus. (In an upgraded AI it might be good if it would postpone these attacks, if at all possible, to later turns, first focusing on attacking the opponent in other areas.)

Since wastelands are by definition controlled by neutral, I'm afraid this will not help you after all. Sorry... :(
maps where each territory has its own bonus: 3/21/2012 18:39:13


Moros 
Level 50
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From my experience the AI still wants to complete bonuses, even if they're neutral. I have tried a couple of games using [this](http://WarLight.net/MultiPlayer.aspx?TemplateID=164762) template, and the AI tries to complete the bonus if you own the last territory, even if it's a negative one.
maps where each territory has its own bonus: 3/21/2012 18:46:14


{rp} General Mac 
Level 53
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hmm that really is a bummer! :(

i was sure you had something there.

i guess we will have to make do on these games untill the AI gets upgraded

im still trying to get my head round why in the early stages of the game the AI takes down some Wastelands but then in later stages leaves them

in this game for instance (just picked one at random)

on turn 20 why does it decide to take south africa?
[Link text](http://WarLight.net/MultiPlayer.aspx?GameID=2393339)



This one is so out of character of the AI on turn 39
[Link text](http://WarLight.net/MultiPlayer.aspx?GameID=2380358)
maps where each territory has its own bonus: 3/21/2012 19:18:28


Metaltubbie 
Level 61
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Another map where every territory has it's own bonus:
http://warlight.net/Map.aspx?ID=1407
maps where each territory has its own bonus: 3/22/2012 02:44:25


Tim (TIM CLAN) 😡 
Level 61
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You can select any map and make it to give bonuses for each territory owned. It is one of the standard options. If you set the region bonuses to zero then you will have the game you are looking for, on any map.

Just select custom game, select the map you want and then go to ARMY SETTINGS and check thee box for give extra armies for territories.

Then you change all the region bonuses further down, on the same page, and set them all to zero.

that should do it.
maps where each territory has its own bonus: 3/22/2012 07:21:51


Muppet
Level 12
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@ Tim The problem with that is that it seems as though the AI doesn't account for armies acquired by "owning" territories. He has tried to do exactly what you suggested and it hasn't worked.
maps where each territory has its own bonus: 3/22/2012 07:46:27


{rp} General Mac 
Level 53
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Hey Tim, yes as Muppet said i have tried that and it doesnt work :(

I think the only option seems to be to wait until The AI gets sorted but we will still have fun playing the games anyway :)
maps where each territory has its own bonus: 3/22/2012 12:34:35

The Duke of Ben 
Level 55
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General, in answer to your question about why the AI attacks, I think that the AI will always continue attacking so long as it's next to a player. It only seems to hit this stalling bug when it has no contacts. It's designed not to waste its time attacking worthless or undesirable places while expanding, so that it doesn't attack actual wastelands in game. It appears to have overriding code that tells it to continue attacking (even against big armies) when in contact with other players.

Best I can figure on turn 39 of the second game, the blockade in Nigeria was small enough that the AI was willing to attack it. Apparently so long as the AI is willing to attack anything, it will attack anywhere it has an advantage. That's all speculation on my part, because that is a pretty weird situation considering the other problems you have had with the AI.
maps where each territory has its own bonus: 3/22/2012 13:02:01


Perrin3088 
Level 44
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I've seen some insane games, where an AI is underpowered purely because he captures all *but one* territory, and another AI gets there a few turns later and captures it.. it remains uncompleted for turns and turns afterwards
maps where each territory has its own bonus: 3/22/2012 16:11:27


Ironheart
Level 53
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general to add to your test you could use medium fog where you can see who has territroy but no numbers ais always attack neutral even with all their power
maps where each territory has its own bonus: 3/22/2012 19:19:50

BishesUpInErr (AHoL)
Level 4
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What about having a person, rather than an AI, control the Zombie? You'd have to find someone trustworthy who'd be willing to surrender when there's only one non-zombie player left, but it's an option.
maps where each territory has its own bonus: 3/23/2012 18:32:41

RvW 
Level 46
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When you're experimenting with fog, don't forget to let yourself see everything; add spy cards (allow spying on neutral: true) to the game, for 100 turns, in one piece, starting pieces: number of players (you don't need to spy on yourself of course, but you do need on to spy on neutral). Doing it this way will allow you to see everything which is going on, and still present the AI with any fog level you want to test.
maps where each territory has its own bonus: 3/23/2012 20:06:49

Chief
Level 2
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i think in the czech republic map (the small one i believe) is every territory is a bonus. the creator of the game may have set it up like that though
maps where each territory has its own bonus: 4/5/2012 02:59:09


Blue 
Level 51
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From the wiki: When deciding whether or not to complete a bonus, the AI currently uses (bonus value) * 3 - (armies we'd have to kill to take the bonus). If this comes out negative, it won't deem the bonus worthy in some cases.
maps where each territory has its own bonus: 4/5/2012 09:22:46


Ⓖ. Ⓐrun 
Level 57
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You shouldn't count on an AI update because then all the single player records and what have you will be null and void. I got this off the Warlight WIKI by the way.
maps where each territory has its own bonus: 4/5/2012 10:14:01

RvW 
Level 46
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Fizzer has stated on multiple occasions that when he'll make an update to the AI, all single player results will be reset. *However*, every time I've seen him say it, he did so in the context of "not making a minor fix, even if it's quick and easy". I cannot remember ever having seen a statement he didn't want to update the AI at all. Quite the opposite really; to the best of my knowledge, he is indeed planning to give the AI an overhaul at some point, it's just not currently at the top of his priority list (I think the mobile clients are??).

So, it will probably happen, it's just one of those "later rather than sooner" things.
maps where each territory has its own bonus: 4/5/2012 17:48:17

[16] Jasper 
Level 52
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The most recent statement I have seen Fizzer make about this, is that he wants improved AIs, but also wants to keep the single player stats valid. As such, he wants to make a system that allows you to pick your AI (eventually). After that, he will be able to make changes to the AI, even without changing the single player levels or invalidating their statistics.
maps where each territory has its own bonus: 4/13/2012 15:20:14


{rp} General Mac 
Level 53
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Thanks for the suggestions

For the record I did some test games with complete fog but giving everyone spy cards

Seems the AI can still tell where the blockades are? !!!

Grumble grumble
[Link text](http://WarLight.net/MultiPlayer.aspx?GameID=2514192)

Take note of turns 63 and 64 in Antarctica. The AI clearly could tell that the blockade was gone and now occupied by a human even though it should be able to see this
maps where each territory has its own bonus: 4/13/2012 16:41:02


Ⓖ. Ⓐrun 
Level 57
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It is a bit annoying, I've never played a stalemated game like that though, lucky me.

I guess this shows that humans are cleverer then computers.

The only solution i can see is a trustworthy human being the zombie, maybe you could on the ZombieRageVirus account. I dunno though, I'm no expert.
maps where each territory has its own bonus: 4/13/2012 16:48:09


{rp} General Mac 
Level 53
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You are lucky Arun, stalemate happen more often than not unfortunatly. Thats the main reason you only get 1 blockade

no it doesnt have the same feel when a human plays as the zombies because that person can actively try to kill off one person who is being annoying. The main fun for me is that you dont quite know what the AI is going to do.
maps where each territory has its own bonus: 4/13/2012 17:33:51

RvW 
Level 46
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Turn 19, the orange player blockades Sudan. Earlier that turn the AI captured it first territory bordering on Sudan, so it can't have any information about the state of Sudan yet (from previous, failed, attacks for instance).

Turn 21, the orange player abandons Somalia. At the moment that happens, the AI isn't even bordering on it, so it can't possibly know *anything* about the status of that territory.
During that same turn, it captures Congo, so now it has a border with Somalia (but, there's complete fog, so it still shouldn't be able to tell anything about it yet).
(During turn 20 and 21, it never attacks Sudan. To be honest, it doesn't have too many armies in the area, so it's possible it would like to attack but simply can't spare the armies.)

Turn 22, the AI has 114 armies in Congo. For ease of reference, Congo has connections to the following territories (in alphabetical order):

- Angola (blue player)
- Botswana (blue player)
- Cameroon (AI)
- Chad (AI)
- Kenya (blue player)
- Somalia (wasteland)
- Sudan (wasteland)

The orders given this turn are (in chronological order):

- 2 armies attack Botswana
- 110 armies attack Angola
- 1 army attacks Congo ("original order sent two armies", details below)

Or, looking at it another way:

- Do not transfer any armies to already owned territories (makes sense).
- Attack all surrounding, *player-owned* territories in the standard "plenty armies available" way, apparently assuming each territory only has a single army on it (as expected).
- Do not attack the wastelands *at all* (this is extremely suspicious behaviour to say the least).

I think you should report this in the bugs forum. Mind you, Fizzer has repeatedly stated he won't make incremental changes to the AI, so it won't be fixed shortly. However, I do think he needs to be aware of this problem for when he finds time (and priority) for a massive AI overhaul.

---

Details about that weird 1-army attack

As described in the [Possible bugs in AI attack logic](http://warlight.net/Forum/Thread.aspx?ThreadID=3143) thread, when the AI has an overwhelming number of armies available and surrounded by territories with one defending army each, it will attack all of them with 2 armies and boosting one of the attacks with "everything else". However, it doesn't account for the army which needs to be left behind, resulting in the last attack always "requesting" one army more than is available. Except when the last attack is the "everything else" one, this means it will be a 1-army attack.

Also look at turn 19 in the same game linked above: Nigeria starts the turn with 6 armies, receives 3 reinforcements (for a total of 9, obviously planning four 2-army attacks). Then the attack into Nigeria gets 3 armies ("everything else", just not a very spectacular one), leaving only a single army for the last attack (into Ghana). If you hover over the order it will still show "original order sent two armies" though.
maps where each territory has its own bonus: 4/13/2012 18:10:13

The Duke of Ben 
Level 55
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Hm, I wondered why the AI sent so many 1 army attacks. It's actually not a bad idea when it only has one army to send, but it frequently does it when it has plenty of armies.

Thanks for doing the research on that.
maps where each territory has its own bonus: 4/13/2012 18:42:21

RvW 
Level 46
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Actually, it is a very bad idea. Using default kill rates and luck, these are the chances:

Defender Defender
killed survives
Attacker killed 42% 28%

Attacker survives 18% 12%

Not so bad you say? Well, the point is, if both the attacker *and* defender die (the most likely case actually), the defender is magically resurrected (since otherwise the territory would have to revert to neutral or something else weird).

So this boils down to a success rate of just 18%, a chance that nothing really happens of 12% and a pointless suicide (attacker killed, defender remains) of 28% **+ 42%** = 60%.

If you only have one army to send, don't send it, it's probably a waste. Instead, wait until next turn and for now, just let it defend. If your opponent decides to do a counter-attack, 2-vs-1 has a better than 88% chance of success, whereas 2-vs-2 has less than 17% chance. If he attacks with 3 armies it's > 96% vs < 69%; one additional defender is very valuable, so don't sacrifice it unless you're very, *very* desperate to break a bonus or earn a card piece or something.
maps where each territory has its own bonus: 4/13/2012 18:53:12

The Duke of Ben 
Level 55
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If you have zero armies to spare, but taking that territory is still worthwhile, then it's not a bad idea to send that 1 troop alone, unless that one is still needed for something.

Watch pwn Trackers play sometime (he sends tons of 1v1 and 2v2, still rated above 1800 on 1v1 ladder) to see how often the attacks work out. 1/5 is pretty low, but that's 1/5 games where he gets a bonus one turn earlier, breaks an enemy bonus he would not have otherwise, etc. Having a strategic territory, or denying it to your enemy, is generally worth much more than the single troop used to do it.

It's clearly situational, and if you have the extra troop(s) to send, it's almost always better to do so, but that doesn't make the attack worthless.

Quite a few #1 players have done it in games they won. I first saw the Impaller do it in a game. I think that Trackers does it too often, but in the games it works, he gets a big advantage, while the disadvantage for when it doesn't work is generally quite small.
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