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Legal to use alt-acct on same team for 2v2 Ladder?: 8/29/2017 20:25:30


Si_vis_pacem_para_bellum 
Level 58
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Hey all :)

The question I have is this:

"Does WarLight rules permit players to team up their alternate accounts on the same team for 2v2 (or 3v3) Ladder games?"

The current WarLight Wiki rule on the matter states:

"You shall not operate more than one WarLight account in a way that gives you an advantage in a game, tournament or ladder. "
[ https://www.warlight.net/wiki/Rules ]

Please note that the WarLight Wiki Rules as it is currently written is a blanket rule. Specifically, it does *not* list an exception for 2v2 ladder games where the alt-account is playing on the same team.

However, some players are arguing that using an alt account on the same team does not pose any advantage and therefore the current rule above does not apply.

I would argue that part of the nature of a 2v2 game is the risk of miscommunication between team players. Since alt-accounts are, by definition, played by the exact same player there is no risk of miscommunication with oneself (at least I would hope not) and that this therefore constitutes an obvious advantage over the other team.

However, although I see the above rule as clear enough, based on the forum posts below, there appears to be confusion on the matter within the WarLight community.

Therefore, I have asked Fizzer to render a final judgement on the matter and will update this post (and all the others below) when he does.

In the meantime, what are your thoughts?

Cheers :)

SiVis

FYI, Other threads on this issue (in chronological order)
- [7/14/2013] From Fizzer (via Yeon/LVL61) on this issue: "You are allowed to have multiple accounts on WarLight. What you aren't allowed to do is to have two in the same game, unless your opponents explicitly give you permission to." [source: https://www.warlight.net/Forum/6350-multiaccount-alt-account ]
- [3/1/2014] From TheFridge/LVL59: "Fizzer said at one point, that using own alt on a Ladder is not permitted. Even in same team of 2v2 Ladder. However there was a number of teams of player+his alt regardless, and seems like Fizzer did not do anything against them." [source: https://www.warlight.net/Forum/31829-moraly-acceptable ]
- [6/9/2014] From Lion/LVL57: "It is completely legal to own multiple accounts. However, you may not use them in the same game (unless it's a team game, and ALL your accounts are on the same team)." [source: https://www.warlight.net/Forum/46524-multiple-accounts ]
- [1/1/2017] From Ravenna/LVL22: "It is allowed to have multiple accounts. However, those accounts aren't allowed to be on opposing teams. You can't play an FFA with them, and if you play a 2v2 or greater, both accounts must be on the same team. Same goes for tournaments and ladders. They must all be on the same team, and there is no multi-accounting on the 1v1 ladder or in 1v1 tournaments. Basically, as long as you don't ever create a situation where your accounts will match up against each other, then it should be fine." [source: https://www.warlight.net/Forum/227041-players-multiple-accounts ]
Legal to use alt-acct on same team for 2v2 Ladder?: 8/29/2017 20:50:24


Timinator • apex 
Level 63
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Having your alt account on your team doesn't give you an advantage in terms of the gameplay. Therefore the rules are sufficient.
Legal to use alt-acct on same team for 2v2 Ladder?: 8/29/2017 20:55:34


LeQuébécois_Benoit
Level 62
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A lot of guys do it. Is it legal or not, one thing is for sure, it seems to be tolerated as long as you are on the same team with yourself.
Legal to use alt-acct on same team for 2v2 Ladder?: 8/29/2017 21:04:16


Si_vis_pacem_para_bellum 
Level 58
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Re: Timinator's comment: "Having your alt account on your team doesn't give you an advantage in terms of the gameplay. Therefore the rules are sufficient."

I would argue that part of the nature of a 2v2 game is the risk of miscommunication between team players. Since alt-accounts are, by definition, played by the exact same player there is no risk of miscommunication with oneself (at least I would hope not) and that this therefore constitutes an obvious advantage over the other team.
Legal to use alt-acct on same team for 2v2 Ladder?: 8/29/2017 21:08:09


LeQuébécois_Benoit
Level 62
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You can also argue that 2 top players will be better than 1 top player X2. 2 brains are better than 1 as they say. Sometimes, having 2 different perspectives on a same thing can make you accomplish something you can't do alone. Although for that to happen, you indeed need a good communication with your partner.

Edited 8/29/2017 21:08:22
Legal to use alt-acct on same team for 2v2 Ladder?: 8/29/2017 21:17:35


Si_vis_pacem_para_bellum 
Level 58
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Re: LeQuébécois_Benoit comment: "You can also argue that 2 top players will be better than 1 top player X2. 2 brains are better than 1 as they say."

LOL! The '2-brains-are-better-than-1' point (assuming it to be true, which is debatable in many, if not most, instances) actually argues for banning different players teaming up in the 2v2 ladder and *only* allowing teamed alt-accounts to play the 2v2 ladder.

Since 2v2 was originally designed for multiple players to team up, and the use of alt-accounts is, in effect, a 'hack' of that original design, I believe this point to be, for the most part, a non-sequitur.
Legal to use alt-acct on same team for 2v2 Ladder?: 8/29/2017 21:51:02


Si_vis_pacem_para_bellum 
Level 58
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I have just talked with Fizzer on the Twitch Livestream, and he has stated that the answer to my question:

"Does WarLight rules permit players to team up their alternate accounts on the same team for 2v2 (or 3v3) Ladder games?" ...


... YES, alternate accounts on the same team for 2v2 (or 3v3) Ladder games is permitted.

Although I do not agree, Fiz himself has now spoken on the matter.
Legal to use alt-acct on same team for 2v2 Ladder?: 8/29/2017 22:07:29


LeQuébécois_Benoit
Level 62
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LOL! The '2-brains-are-better-than-1' point (assuming it to be true, which is debatable in many, if not most, instances) actually argues for banning different players teaming up in the 2v2 ladder and *only* allowing teamed alt-accounts to play the 2v2 ladder.

Since 2v2 was originally designed for multiple players to team up, and the use of alt-accounts is, in effect, a 'hack' of that original design, I believe this point to be, for the most part, a non-sequitur.


Clearly not. It shows that you don't have just advantages teaming up with yourself on the 2v2 ladder.
Legal to use alt-acct on same team for 2v2 Ladder?: 8/29/2017 22:14:54


Si_vis_pacem_para_bellum 
Level 58
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You may be right, LQ :)

I think the trend of more and more alt-account/2v2 teams speaks for itself. If it was such a disadavantage then why would so many people be doing it?

So the 'hack' wins. Best be off to set up my first alt-account. Later ;)

Edited 8/29/2017 22:15:38
Legal to use alt-acct on same team for 2v2 Ladder?: 8/30/2017 03:45:40


Cowboy 
Level 57
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Playing yourself is banned (in most cases), but this is a very common practice. I prefer to play with teammates but I can clearly see why people just prefer to make their own team. Most prevalent problem with playing with others, rather then yourself is motivation. I can't count how many of my team runs ended because of boots or disinterest.
This gets even worse on the 3v3 ladder.
Legal to use alt-acct on same team for 2v2 Ladder?: 8/30/2017 03:47:13


LeQuébécois_Benoit
Level 62
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You still need to be a very good player though imo to manage to be in the top 10 of the 2v2 ladder. If you check the guys that are there X2 in the top 10, they are all top tier players.

Edited 8/30/2017 03:47:38
Legal to use alt-acct on same team for 2v2 Ladder?: 8/30/2017 08:17:56

DanWL 
Level 62
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As long as the alts are on the same team or in a 1v1 game against yourself but not in an FFA, then it's fine.
Legal to use alt-acct on same team for 2v2 Ladder?: 8/30/2017 10:02:49


Krzysztof 
Level 66
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I think the trend of more and more alt-account/2v2 teams speaks for itself. If it was such a disadavantage then why would so many people be doing it?


few potential reasons:
- less time consuming
- you can play the way you want to play, no need to adjust gamestyle to partner
- no need to make commitments. Assuming i would join other player, i would feel bad if i joined someone and resigned half way wasting time.
- you rely only on you, someone's mistakes(boots) won't hurt you.

2 brains is better than 1. But this concerns potential. You need to work harder and spend more time to reach it. If you play only be yourself, it's easier to squeeze everything you can from your abilities, but the ceiling would be higher if you would have someone to help. Apparently it's just high enough for many to get what they want.
Legal to use alt-acct on same team for 2v2 Ladder?: 8/30/2017 22:36:23


LeQuébécois_Benoit
Level 62
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+1 Krzystof
Legal to use alt-acct on same team for 2v2 Ladder?: 8/31/2017 18:41:39


Platinum
Level 60
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Problem with 2v2 Alts = They don't stay on ladders. 10 games and that's it. Not "Healthy" for a 2v2 Ladder.

If you were in charge of the 2v2 Ladder, This would be ringing in your head making the decision "Should alts be allowed or not?"

God has spoken so alt, away we do so..

Edited 8/31/2017 18:42:01
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