Yes X I know that, but teaching dumb Christians about it would help.

There you go, this is our understanding.

It's not an understanding, just a truth...it's like saying we have an understanding that that water is H2O. And anyone who denies this, from a scientific and technic aspect, is just anti-truth, not having a "misunderstanding"...

I don't think you really understand the amount of people who simply refuse to acknowledge this basic fact,

...However. It is almost impossible to say that these womb dwellers are characteristically a fellow or child, which is what makes the difference in my thought. And these folk you speak of are probably saying that they are not characteristically human, but they probably agree that it's technically human.

You and I may disagree about the value of human life, but this is primarily a theological debate.

No, it isn't? It's philosophic, but anyhow - my point still stands, if you are against abortion, then it's just very hypocritic and disrespectful to be for slaughter.

teaching dumb Christians about it would help.

Ok, sure, put that in the public school curricula - problem answered.

And these folk you speak of are probably saying that they are not characteristically human, but they probably agree that it's technically human.

This isn't even the case though; You can check out some earlier posts in the thread to see richard to see Ox denying that they are biologically human:

A fetus is not a body.

A fetus turns into a body at the point in time which it can sustain life on its own. Prior to that, it is a parasite

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it's like saying we have an understanding that that water is H2O

You can bet that there will be someone denying it if it fits their agenda.

Edited 5/14/2016 02:57:55

You can check out some earlier posts in the thread to see richard to see Ox denying that they are biologically human:

They're not saying that it's not biologically human. To those who are though, that's pretty dumb. Birthing crocodiles or something instead, then?

Unless for some reason they're claiming that they are humans, just humans without bodies, then yes; They definitely are denying it.

Unless for some reason they're claiming that they are humans, just humans without bodies, then yes

I think body is kind of the wrong word to wield here, but there are humans without (characteristically human) bodies. Would you call a group of 48 cells a body?

I think body is kind of the wrong word to wield here, but there are humans without (characteristically human) bodies. Would you call a group of 48 cells a body?

"body" is the word that they used, and it is what they are denying a child in the womb is.

It doesn't really matter what sort of characteristics they have, It is just a body that is not fully developed yet. After all, a group of forty eight cells is indeed less than a group of around 37.2 trillion, but it's technically just the same thing; A group of cells.

Edited 5/14/2016 03:22:21

In which case going by your logic imperator, you can't afford to kill anything due to opposing abortion, but unicellular organisms(good luck survivng on Giant alagae), as all other organisms are made of groups of cells.

a group of forty eight cells is indeed less than a group of around 37.2 trillion, but it's technically just the same thing; A group of cells.

They're both a cell group, but are they both bodies? Wiktionary: "The physical structure of a human or animal seen as one single organism.". I guess. Whatever, I'll stop trying to shield them, I might be misrepresenting them.

In which case going by your logic imperator, you can't afford to kill anything due to opposing abortion, but unicellular organisms(good luck survivng on Giant alagae), as all other organisms are made of groups of cells.

I don't oppose any killing besides that of Humans. It's really that simple, as Juq put it i'm a "Nasty human supremacist".

I literally don't have to oppose killing plants, or animals, or anything else. I simply believe that humans are special, which is not an unreasonable belief by the way.

They're both a cell group, but are they both bodies? Wiktionary: "The physical structure of a human or animal seen as one single organism.". I guess. Whatever, I'll stop trying to shield them, I might be misrepresenting them.

Like I said, i'm just not really interested in debating the issue again with you. We already both know where the other stands, and honestly I'm pretty okay with you being pro-abortion as long as you acknowledge that it is human life that is being killed.

Edited 5/14/2016 03:34:58

We already both know where the other stands, and honestly I'm pretty okay with you being pro-abortion as long as you acknowledge that it is human life that is being killed.

Ok, this isn't about abortion, then, this is about supremacism of your kind.

- Would you want aliens to do the same thing to humans as other humans have done to "lower life"? Most folk knowledgeable in this fear that if we meet aliens, they could be just so much more technologically avanced than us, that they'll just enslave us, perhaps eat us. Not fun.

Humans are special...sure about as special as a species with the functional capacity to annihilate the world, and quickly progressing towards it, which yes, makes us special, but also allows for us to be blamed if we kill off the world(which we are doing at an alarming rate thanks to global warming).

I guess that's reasonable. So you would be okay with abortions conducted on for instance monkeys, but not humans?

Ok, this isn't about abortion, then, this is about supremacism of your kind.

- Would you want aliens to do the same thing to humans as other humans have done to "lower life"? Most folk knowledgeable in this fear that if we meet aliens, they could be just so much more technologically avanced than us, that they'll just enslave us, perhaps eat us. Not fun.

If there really are aliens that are more technologically advanced than us, then to be honest I really have to rethink my philosophy. However, I am personally a very strong believer in the idea that humans are the most advanced life that exists anywhere, and so far at least, This hasn't turned out to be unreasonable.

In a way I am very opposed to the idea of aliens, as it's very problematic from a theological standpoint. In fact, I'd argue that if aliens more intelligent than humans are found, this will be a very strong argument against christianity.

No humans aren't going to kill off the planet through global warming. Maybe through bombing the heck out of it, but not through getting of the carbon drought. Getting rid of the carbon drought will probably help too.

Humans are special...sure about as special as a species with the functional capacity to annihilate the world, and quickly progressing towards it, which yes, makes us special, but also allows for us to be blamed if we kill off the world(which we are doing at an alarming rate thanks to global warming).

I guess that's reasonable. So you would be okay with abortions conducted on for instance monkeys, but not humans?

Sure humans are bad, but there's not really any denying that we are at the very least more intelligent than the beasts, none of whom have ever developed the capacity to destroy themselves.

The problem of abortion really doesn't even exist for any other creature (another example of how humans are special). After all, there is literally no other creature which could possibly imagine killing it's young before they left the womb, and indeed beasts don't even have the capacity to perform abortions.

What I'm basically saying is, Abortion doesn't exist in nature.

Edited 5/14/2016 03:48:45

Unless you can show me a point at which it turns into a body, the only logical assumption is that it has always been a body.





does that mean a sperm is a body, or an ovary a body, well in that case you are a mass murderer

does that mean a sperm is a body, or an ovary a body, well in that case you are a mass murderer

No, it doesn't. Practically everyone agrees that it is the union of a sperm and egg through sex that creates a Human.

Murdering half of a person isn't even really an issue, since a human being cannot exist with only half of itself, therefore making it not a human and therefore not murder.

Edited 5/14/2016 03:56:55

Practically everyone agrees that it is the union of a sperm and egg through sex that creates a person.

I would disagree, I would call that a human zygote, and not a person. I don't believe a person is developed until they have a brain, as I view that the reason why people are the dominant species is due to our cognitive functions.

I would disagree, I would call that a human zygote, and not a person. I don't believe a person is developed until they have a brain, as I view that the reason why people are the dominant species is due to our cognitive functions.

Meant to say Human there; Practically everyone agrees that Human life is created at conception, but people like Juq make a distinction between "Human" and "Person".

Edited 5/14/2016 04:05:26

I am personally a very strong believer in the idea that humans are the most advanced life that exists anywhere

Really? Cause that really doesn`t seem right to me. Around 12 billion years to develop an organism more advanced than humans is more than enough. Even on our planet there could`ve been an advanced lifeform (but instead we got things like dinosaurs, which are also awesome). To say that we are the most advance lifeform in the entire universe seems like antropocentrism on the highest possible level.