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When someone says "card piece": 10/17/2013 02:48:15


professor dead piggy 
Level 59
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What they actually mean is a piece of the +5 reinforcement card because that is the only card that matters. It dominates games with early contact and squishes a lot of subtlety out of those games. Make it +3 and let people win by sitting on a higher income in the first 4 turns.
When someone says "card piece": 10/17/2013 03:57:35


[REGL] Pooh 
Level 60
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I'm missing the coherence of that message.
When someone says "card piece": 10/17/2013 04:02:18


professor dead piggy 
Level 59
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+5 Reinforcement card is over powered in the first 5 to 9 turns of the game. This is so widely accepted among WL players that we have started to refer to the reinforcement card piece as "the card piece".
When someone says "card piece": 10/17/2013 04:38:03


Pushover 
Level 59
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I only kinda sorta agree with you Piggy, "card pieces" can be important later in the game for reasons other than reinforcements. How many times have we all gone "Man, it'd be really nice to have an order delay card right now." (Or priority, or blockade) As far as reinforcements being a big deal early in the game, yeah I agree. But is this necessarily a bad thing?

Will you be creating a tourney with modified settings? Can I be invited? :3
When someone says "card piece": 10/17/2013 15:13:08


ps 
Level 60
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you mean the master race settings aren't perfect after all? *world crumbles*

create a tournament with your improved settings you zombie swine excuse for a tiger.
When someone says "card piece": 10/17/2013 16:14:29


[REGL] Pooh 
Level 60
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But don't both teams get cards at the same rate?

Its part of the calculated risk (I feel) on whether or not you are taking a territory that turn to get the "Card Piece"

Do you 100% stack against the guy and not get a card... or do you stack all but for a 3v2 to risk it... or stack all but 4v2 to guarantee it...

In the early game, there is a decision to be made, and yes, it is important because the wrong decision (even if based on luck) can determine the outcome.
When someone says "card piece": 10/17/2013 17:22:45


Kenny • apex 
Level 59
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You don't even need to use the reinforcement card on the turn you get it for a decisive advantage. Sometimes the decisive advantage comes when your opponent doesn't expect you to use it. (1-2 turns after you got it) I like to mix my reinforcement cards with OP or OD cards to maximize my advantage if I don't need to use it the turn I get it.

Edited 10/17/2013 17:23:20
When someone says "card piece": 10/18/2013 00:03:06


professor dead piggy 
Level 59
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No, both sides do not get cards at the same rate. You get cards when you take territories.

Any advantage, besides clearing from an area, you build up in the first 5 turns is worth nothing if youre behind in cards.

Edited 10/18/2013 00:09:32
When someone says "card piece": 10/18/2013 02:23:04


Sir Dolphin VI 
Level 56
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I think I see a hole in your logic, Piggy. If the player in question is too incompetent to take territories, then do they really deserve a card? NEIN.
When someone says "card piece": 10/18/2013 04:26:58


professor dead piggy 
Level 59
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No, you dont see a hole in a fucking thing you porpoise. If someone chooses not to take a territory then they definitely dont deserve a card piece.

I am saying let it be a valid strategy to opt NOT to go for card(s).

Edited 10/18/2013 04:36:10
When someone says "card piece": 10/18/2013 04:41:20


DOOM 
Level 46
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This is just Sad
When someone says "card piece": 10/18/2013 05:58:57


professor dead piggy 
Level 59
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I know right? I make a constructive criticism of the game and propose a solution and everyone just wants to fight me.

Edited 10/18/2013 05:59:09
When someone says "card piece": 10/18/2013 06:00:49


Kenny • apex 
Level 59
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(slaps piggy with a white glove) Prepare yourself for a duel of fisticuffs.
When someone says "card piece": 10/18/2013 10:41:58


ps 
Level 60
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i do want to fight you. in the tournament you'll create.
When someone says "card piece": 10/18/2013 12:34:34


Sir Dolphin VI 
Level 56
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Sigh...Piggy, are you actually saying you want to make it a valid strategy not to go for cards, and, by extent, never take territories? Why would you do that, even if cards didn't exist? Because...you want to stack up armies and wait for your opponent to find you? Your foe will surpass you on income if you do that...
When someone says "card piece": 10/18/2013 12:45:27


{rp} GeneralGror
Level 58
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He was talking about early on in the game.
When someone says "card piece": 10/18/2013 12:45:58


professor dead piggy 
Level 59
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Yes, on the occasional turn.
When someone says "card piece": 10/19/2013 15:26:09


Perrin3088 
Level 44
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Piggy, lets say standard rules.. so 60-70 attack-defend with R card for 4 pieces and 16% luck..

If you attack with 4 to ensure absolute victory every turn to get the 4 card pieces, you will lose 2*0.7 *4 armies on average... which adds up to 5.6 armies. thus the R card is worth 5 armies.. really, it's not advantageous to gather the R card just for R cardiness, save for making a big push in one turn.

the fail in your logic.. is that in the first 5-9 turns, you should be using your forces to gain bonuses.. and while you're at it, you gain card pieces.

furthermore.. if you want to create a game without card pieces.. use the template for the strategic 1v1 remove 1 from the card pieces per turn, and remove the R card.. problem solved.



Personally, I find that the OD and OP cards can be way more useful than the R card.. while the R card is just an incentive for the natural expansion you should already be doing.
When someone says "card piece": 10/19/2013 16:46:10

Qi 
Level 55
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Yeah, I also agree that piggy has absolutely no idea what he is talking about. If the ability to exploit the settings and win games is any indication of understanding how every minute detail in settings influence a game, his understanding of how the cards influence the game is not at all comparable to his esteemed critics', especially given they might have gained the highly coveted "Played wl in beta" gold trophy, which makes them like a fine wine in comparison to this pig's swill.

Edited 10/19/2013 16:48:59
When someone says "card piece": 10/21/2013 13:06:03


professor dead piggy 
Level 59
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Perrin, dont you know who I am? How dare you list strat 1v1 settings to me?

I dont like you but I am compelled to respond to your drivel because you dumped it in my thread.

Warlight would be more strategically varied and challenging if players were penalised a little less in the opening 5-10 turns for choosing not to make an attack. It would allow someone to deploy and simply make no moves, in an attempt to win by holding onto their positional advantage.

A card is not a reward, paying you back the armies that you lost in killing neutrals. That role is filled by bonuses. A card rewards a player for playing aggressively (which makes for a fun game usually). The idea of cards for sucessful attacks dates back to "risk" which was a FFA and it was necessary to encourage people to be aggressive. In a 1v1 you dont need such a strong incentive to aggression, it has reached the point where people are more limited in their choices because of cards.

Edited 10/21/2013 13:11:00
When someone says "card piece": 10/21/2013 13:56:59

Qi 
Level 55
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Welcome to my world, pig. This formulaic 1v1 template is all about pick lottery and attack/defense luck. This template does not reflect warlight skill so much as the ability to master a template that is unlike the vast majority of non-1v1 ME warlight games being played. What is the purpose of a template that reflects so little of the strategic and tactical options available?

Like I have said before, this template is like shooting free throws. With free throws, form and technique matter. The actual ability to play basketball, run up and down the court, endurance, etc. are not a part of shooting free throws.

The very idea of 1v1s is a bit odd, unless a player can control multiple armies that each have their own independent sets of orders per turn (ie, a team game within the 1v1 game mode). Since when are wars won based on the result of an isolated duel? And with rewards (reinforcement cards) for spreading oneself thin (ie, overextending)?

I have never been a fan of this template, given what Fizzer COULD do if he bothered to make something that better reflects the essence of war, given the nature of the warlight style of war gaming. The possibilities exist to make a far superior template. Fizzer is complacent with free throw shooting and is not interested in playing a real game of basketball.

Edited 10/21/2013 13:58:35
When someone says "card piece": 10/21/2013 14:08:51


professor dead piggy 
Level 59
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You dont realise that this template *is* warlight. The other games people are playing are fun little asides.

What settings are like a game of basketball?
When someone says "card piece": 10/21/2013 14:33:07

Qi 
Level 55
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This template is what warlight has become, based on how Fizzer has pushed it (autogames for lazy, ladder for thoughtless) on the thoughtless many who are too lazy to experiment with game settings on their own to make, play, and insist on something better.

1v1 ME is the best of all possible worlds, if the world lacks creativity.
When someone says "card piece": 10/21/2013 14:40:29


professor dead piggy 
Level 59
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Auotgames for people who cant stand 75% luck and ladders for people who cant find decent opponents in autogames any more.

I've never played a 1v1 template that had more of a chess feel to it than strat 1v1. Its simple enough to be short and easy to understand and complex enough that someone good can beat someone bad every time, it is always different and noone good is anywhere near perfect.
When someone says "card piece": 10/21/2013 15:50:39

Widzisz • apex 
Level 60
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Warlight would be more strategically varied and challenging if players were penalised a little less in the opening 5-10 turns for choosing not to make an attack.


Capture territory each turn or die, true.

Sometimes it is really challenging to get reinforcement card as fast as (or faster than) your enemy, but I don't really like this to be honest. Mainly because when you add that to other settings, it's too much luck dependent.

Yet I don't think "reinforcement card +5" is that awful now.
I mean, it's not the first (nor 2nd or 3rd) thing I would change in the 1vs1 Strategic settings if I could.
It's somewhere in the middle of my list.

I prefer no reinforcement cards at all, but for a totally different reason.
When someone says "card piece": 10/21/2013 23:13:57


Kenny • apex 
Level 59
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I like 2-turn reinforcement cards of 1 or 2. I think those are the easiest to deal with and still retain the importance of reinforcement cards.
When someone says "card piece": 10/22/2013 04:58:44


Pushover 
Level 59
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Seriously guys, why are you not making games and tournaments with your preferred settings? Is complaining really that much fun?

(I kid, of course complaining is fun!)
When someone says "card piece": 10/22/2013 23:05:17


Z-Dog 
Level 54
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What templates do you guys prefer over 1v1 ME then?
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