Me: "If 400 millions Muslims died, I'd give them Palestine."


Ox: "You can't do shit about who gets what."
Ok, but if I could I would, and if I couldn't I would support doing so. Nitpicking my ideas for technicalities is your only hope when you can't argue with the thought behind them.

+1000 Empire of Kilos is angry at Liberals & PC . Show how they lie.
"Ox Austria isn't relevant to the discussion at all. Austria was an empire. Israel is a nation of people who are native to that land." Spot on. And if you say the Jews took it from the people in 2000 BC, stfu. Every modern nation would be illegitimate.

Edited 1/14/2016 21:01:26

"CONGRATS ON BEING MORE LIBERAL THAN SAUDI ARABIA AND IRAN."
*more liberal then every majority Muslim nation on Earth.

GeneralPE, stop your liberal propaganda, being liberal does not mean necessarily being free, liberalism is just a political and economic worldview, so stop mixing things.

Ok, how about more free, progressive, and equal?

It's okay 674, free and equal works too. If he wants to nitpick like Ox, have at it. They are just proving they have no good arguements.

"What you say about history - WHO CARES?

I don't give a DAMN if Israel used to own the land. Look what Austria used to own!"
Ok. In that case, why do you show these false maps from 1948? If history doesn't matter, why do they?

I never denied Israel being a democratic nation, still abuses exist, this is what I was talking about everything is not white nor black, both sides committed wrong and condemnable acts. Israel militarily speaking is not an example, see also the War in Lebanon. The destruction of Beyrouth once nicknamed the "Paris of Orient", a very wealthy city, a top economic and cultural place, once outmatching Tel Aviv as the financial center of the Middle east, were people of different religions and origin coexisted peacefully.

And Trollberg, despite your hate against the Muslims, if the Muslims are so evil, why did the Christian Palestinians and Christians of Lebanon (constituting half of the country's population) fight against the Israeli Army? Don't you see something wrong here?

Edited 1/14/2016 21:16:34

Koala, when Beirut was the Paris of the Orient Lebanon was majority Chritian. It was the Muslim shift which turned it into a war-plagued 3rd-world hellhole. Once more proving Muslims en masse do not benefit society. We gave Jews the small state of Israel, Christians the even smaller Lebanon, put in place laws so Muslims could still live there, and then gave Muslims the rest of the Middle East. They then proceded to fuck shit up.

EDIT: abuses do exist, but only because of Palestinian actions.

Edited 1/14/2016 21:24:15

"I never denied Israel being a democratic nation"
It is more than democracy, it is the equal treatment under the law that Sharia and the dhimma system (both integral parts of Islam) lack.

Also, Clement, what were you thinking choosing Palestine? You have to have known the controversy it would engender.

Palestine has a lot more than 20 UN members recognising it, so it's eligible and I didn't choose it. I used this random number generator: http://www.wolframalpha.com/widgets/view.jsp?id=298f587406c914fad5373bb689300433 and it gave me the number I assigned to Palestine.

Ok, but still.....I would've re-run the generator

Ox who cares about the muslims. They're dangerous and a threat to western civilization if it was up to them the west would be destroyed tomorrow. They need to be put down they're backwards savages who refuse to integrate and adapt to the modern world.

You never said you hated the Muslims sure, do you have some kind of disease close to amnesia?

the christians are fighting against the muslims as well....its not like they are brothers in arms against jews.

They used (and are still) to be brothers in arms, fighting in the same army, Christians generals and commanders led Muslim armies, and the contrary was also true, the Lebanese government was an example of tolerance, constituted half by Muslims half by Christians, they coexisted for centuries there. Christian militias were even created to fight the Israeli invasion.

The destabilization of the whole region by western powers is the main reason of the rise of extremism and hatred, if you look it up historically speaking, Muslims had tolerant societies even before Western civilizations.

What led to the situation we know currently in Palestine and other places, are mainly results of socio economical factors, not culture/religion. Hence summarize the situation with "they are Muslim, they are backwards, they are savage" is a total idiocy.

Muslims were once more tolerant (if only because they realized the jizya taxes were beneficial and better than wasting energy on persecution when the economic strain would cause most to convert. it was never out of the goodness of their heart. They wer). However, they always had the culture of miltiant jihad; Mohammed was a warlord more then preacher. And I judge Muslims by what they do today.

"What led to the situation we know currently in Palestine and other places, are mainly results of socio economical factors, not culture/religion."
That is wrong. They blow themselves up in the name of Allah, not cuz they're unemployed.

Edited 1/14/2016 21:43:17

Wow koala come down. This is why I prefer not to debate you, your rude and arrogant. It's completely true, and there's no way Palestine could live without foreign aid. Do you realize the country is basically just one city of tents with basically no resources? It's not like Wal-Mart is GONNA expand there or anything. Koala listen to me you angry little Marsupial XD I'm saying " Palestine " not the Gaza strip. So your argument is basically give them the land.....just because it sounds good? Really? That's it?. Look I support Palestinian statehood however I don't support them getting any Israeli land. How are you so blind? This has nothing to do with independence! This is an ideological struggle and any middle eastern expert will tell you these two factions will fight til one is dead

This is different from what we know. In the west, the concept of fighting a nation or group of people til they are obliterated is horrific to us but to Muslims and Jews this is the only path to take. How many times have Israel and Palestine made peace just so Palestine can kill some more innocent people within a couple weeks. It's so bad now that when Palestinian signs a ' peace agreement ' Israeli simply prepares for the next round of fighting because they know that the PLA word means less then dog crap

Edited 1/14/2016 21:48:45

So true conservative

But seriously Koala, I would prefer even if you disagree with me please refrain from personal attacks such as calling me a liar

Conservative, I don't get why again you look for confrontation, most of the thing you said I agreed on them and there are even things I never stated, I am starting to wonder if you have something against me really?

Gaza is dying without humanitarian aid, I said this earlier (if you took little attation about what I wrote really), and they cannot survive without it because they are victims of what the Jews (what a irony_) were victims 70 years earlier: Palestinians of Gaza are living in a giant concentration camp.

The thing I blame about Israel is that they blockade even foreign humanitarian aids to the Gaza strip, letting 2 million people dying of starving and misery, and you still do not see guys where the hatred/violence come from?

For a first world and so-called democratic nation, Israel is not acting in the right way. This has nothing to do with arrogance, you are the one confusing everything I said: I never said anything like Palestine should have Israeli lands, never. I was just defending the recognition of their state, that's all.

I love debating,it's like a mental game of chess but with facts but it'd only enjoyable if everyone does it cleanly, politely, and with honour

And I agree with you. What do you mean I'm looking for confrontation? XD I love you man lol Socialists and Europeans are fun to debate. I also condemn Israeli actions against Gaza but I was talking about the west bank otherwise known as Palestine by the locals