We aren't following Chokecherry's method though. This is not going to be exactly the same as the promotion/reglation league except with clans. The Clan League tries to make better matchups so everyone can enjoy it more. The promotion/reglation league treats every new player exactly equal. That's fine, but it leads to less interest in the clan league and less competition at the higher levels.

But, you are right about the exception. Here's how the rules should be amended to fix that problem:

1. 2 clans from each group must be promoted and 2 must be reglated
a. If there will be no group added for the next clan league, the 2 clans that are scheduled to be reglated will stay in their current league.
b. Group A clans can not be promoted.
2. Each group shall have 7 clans, with the exception of the bottom group
3. Superpromotions take priority over new clans.
a. This means that if a clan wins a group, they are guarenteed to be at least equal with a new clan.
4. New clans fill in the open spots, and if there are not enough open spots, another league is formed.
a. If the new clans are to be put in different leagues, Group A's clans will be in charge of ranking them.

These are the rules I would like to use in all clan leagues so please point out any other errors you see in them so that I can fix them and make sure it runs smoothly.

Edited 11/3/2013 20:38:44

MC is now ahead of Dragon. MC is either 5th/6th (But that doesn't matter here) and Dragon is 7th.

There's still the point that if the group size is 7, *someone new* will need to fill the last spot on B (assuming we only have 13 returning clans for next season).

If you keep Dragon in Group B (Relegating only BR) then you have 7. This kind of makes sense as Dragon/MC/Master were pretty close (With Dragon falling ever so slightly behind.)

Promotion relegation leagues somehow work (1v1 p/r as far as i remember will be hosted for the 11th time, and it works perfectly as-is).

With this, there are actually more promotions and less relegations going on as Chokecherry (Now Frank) has to deal with a constantly-changing roster of people joining and leaving the league. It works very well in its own right, but isn't compatible with JSA's set of rules. Of course, clans are a lot less likely to leave than players.

If you actually look carefully at the Pro/Rel league Chokecherry puts new people on a first-come/first serve basis, sometimes having one or two of the first new players in a higher level group than the others. People probably don't complain as much as 1) Each season is pretty short, about 1-2 months and 2) First come/first serve is completely objective.

Also I'm pretty sure MC is a dead clan by now.

Someone should probably see if it's actually dead. >.>

Group A - new clans,

Groups B - old group A

Group C - old group B!

New clans should start in A and fight their way to B - which will be the true A! everybody will have nearer to the top cause previous group B will try to get promoted! and 2 calns from A will get promoted to play with the new clans, as well as 2 will get relegated to fight the former low tier!

Awesome, isn't it?



don't change the rules. Start from bottom. it's a LEAGUE. or make draws and playoffs, but that's plain stupid and counterproductive if you want to rate clans this way.

Fridge, Please provide evidence I am changing the rules. I would love for you to point out one time so far that these rules have not been followed. The truth is, I have followed these rules all along, I am just now putting them into writing, which is long overdue.

The only possible reason I can see why you would disagree with me is if you think I am changing the rules. And I am not.

I am trying to make sure all of these rules can hold up for all future seasons as well as this one. Like I said, this is not Chokecherry's league, it's the Clan League. Ranking clans is the quickest and easiest way of deciding who gets the open spots.

yeah - and the best (easiest) way to rank them is by voting. Stop acting stupid. This is NOT chokecherry's, this is YOUR LEAGUE yeeeeeaaaaaaahhh - do you feel better now? you don't have to do anything differently to the ther event just to show you are better or something. the way chokecherry did it was FAIR. make it A B C1 C2 and don't force any of the new clans to be included anywhere higher than C. That was the rule implemented last time. NEW PEOPLE START FROM THE BOTTOM. NO CLAN SHOULD GET ANY HEAD START. what you propose is giving a head start to ONE of the NEW clans. That's against the rules we implemented last time, and i agree with mosquitero here it would not be fair or historically justified in any way.

First off, I reiterate my request to have this discussed among the clan representatives of at minimum group A, probably group B as well (there are a lot of good clans in group B). I think we should go with what the clans want.

Second, I find interesting the ideological divide of "clans of similar skill should play each other" vs. "clans should earn their way to the top competition". Both are valid opinions but it seems to me that they clash with each other a bit. Makes for a fascinating discussion I think. A particularly interesting wrinkle: technically Malamute and JSA are in the same clan now. :P

Personally I agree with Malamute here but I think both have good points.

Edited 11/3/2013 21:01:27

We are not in the same clan. JSA is neither [WM] nor [20]. As far as i know, he was never part of [20] clan, and for sure he was thrown out of WM very soon after joining it.

Edited 11/3/2013 21:05:42

What the hell are you talking about Fridge? I was not thrown out of [WM], I took the tag off my name because I am very inactive at the moment and haven't had time to be a real part of a clan. I was planning on readding the tag when I became active again. I've never wanted to be in [20] clan, I heard they weren't planning on doing very little clan activities, and I would prefer a more active clan than that.

Fridge, what you fail to realize in terms of this argument is that last time, clans were decided in a qualifying league (the 2nd clan league). This is the first real promotion/reglation shift of the clan league. There were no open spots in the third clan league in A, but there is an open spot in B for the 4th clan league. Do you not see the difference?

Pushover, I might as well ask the representatives of the clans, I'm not going to change my rules I put above unless the Group A clans vote with Mosquierto's idea. And Fridge isn't gonna quit complaining how my rules are so unterribly unfair either. So your option is best :)

JSA-Im not here to talk about skills with a completely noob player like you!
...you've never hold first place in 1v1 ladder, you've never hold top 3 in 2vs2 ladder after have changed hundreds of teamates...you do not have the slightest idea of how to play a game 3vs3 in europe......If you think you can improve your skills by continuing to change clan tag....i have a bad notice for you!
I hope at least you learned something from your trial period as a mascot in the 20.....

OMG beware of mighty beelzebub.
For example i care. Good work in organize JSA. Thx.
Btw is 20 new elite clan, i imagine belzebub is your new mighty leader? Good luck with this shitty clan member, you already gain yourself bad reputation just after clan started.

....said the clan leader of the FARM/BOOT clan, the clan with the best reputation in WL.

Now, after 418 days of inactivity, comes to me natural to ask ......Have Blitzy (http://warlight.net/Profile?p=979669229) stop to farm GG accounts or you just replaced him with another alt??

....Let's try to make this forum funny!!!

1) i am not complaining. I am disagreeing with your idea, JSA.

2) as far as i know, you are no longer in WM. it's up to Red, not me - so maybe i'm wrong - ask him. you joined only to collect the tag, we knew that from the beginning, gave you the opportunity to prove that wrong, and now that you achieved the tag, and removed it for no reason, we decided the trial has ended. you failed.

you are from US jsa? right? you can ask for join ahol ....

But Beelzebub, as nooby as I am, I still beat you 2/2, the great 99% winner, who has taken 1st in the 1v1 ladder, with 2 different teammates in the 2v2 ladder, soon to be a third possibly. How did this happen? I guess I just got really, really lucky?

Why would you let me in to collect the tag then? That doesn't make sense. I consider myself to still be in [WM]. Just because I took the tag off does not mean I quit the clan. In all honesty, I didn't want to be in a clan when I have a very good chance of getting booted. It makes me feel like a bad clanmate when I leave my teammates hanging. Once I become more active again, I can play some games and get up 5 levels and change the name easily. It just makes me sure I am planning on staying on warlight and not leaving again, because it will take a little bit of time and activity to gain the 5 levels. It's like a mental thing for myself, you probably aren't gonna understand my reasoning behind it. I guess you guys have misjudged me, which I can understand, but I don't like it. If I really wanted all of the good clan's tags on my name, why wouldn't I ask to join [20]?

I have thought about asking to join AHOL before. I like all of the guys in it. I just feel like I took warlight too seriously to be in that clan. I've changed my stance on that but at the moment, I'm kinda burned out on being in clans. Even if I do leave [WM] in the future, I'm not sure if I'd join another clan ever. I like them, but 90% of clan stuff can be done without being in a clan. I feel like most of that other 10% is the clan league, and that is why I keep doing it.

Calm it people. Lets get back to topic. Personally I think we should stick to the way it was meant to be:
Group A: WM, Apex, WG, Ahol, GG, VIW, BIA
(Simple because BIA is basically CPU team last season)
Group B: WL, Regl, 101st, Warlighters, Dragons, BR, (best new clan) XCD's good but there might be better) (MC I believe is dead)
Group C: The best 7 new clans
Group D: The next best 7 clans
And so on.........simple.

I can do what ever you need me to do. When we get the template and format ready. I will ask a load of clans, if they would like to play.

We should just stick to last years rules/format/template. With lots of people coming up with different ideas, it just over complicates things. The clan leagues meant to be simple and fun.

Edited 11/3/2013 22:33:51

C'mon Jsa.....Happens...I can say that I have always won against Luxis apex, which is a player that hold #1 with a better rating than me but I've always lost against GMontag which is a player than have never hold the top....number of games played not very indicative!!

active, lucky, motivated, focused, have time to think. this is gui's guide to be #1.....be motivated in a league C against noobs its really hard, thats why im sure 20 isnt interested at this....
If gui had been interested in your clan league , he would have join from the first edition....dont you think? if he made his clan official its "only" for the new clan system....
aniway at him last word...

Ahol, WM , P , WG , CK, CPU......I know that you love all clans and the whole warlight community except me, with me only hard sex in forum...How did this happen? I guess I just got really, really huge cock?

-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-

Aranka and blitzy, What is common to these 2 players?

Yes BIA should remplace cpu for the reason that apollo explain.

mayhem whenever jay comes around.

i didnt bother to read all that. so is xcd or bia doing this?

i think we want either Group A or Group C, since we a new clan, not Group B, is that ok?

Edited 11/3/2013 23:01:24

Group B: WL, Regl, 101st, Warlighters, Dragons, BR, (best new clan) XCD's good but there might be better) (MC I believe is dead) (Master is apparently not worth mentioning)

WL get booted in some RR if i remember right. Before put them in B, make sure to check if they are still active. I can help for stuff of A league like i did for post update of point if you need.

okay i glanced through all that. go beelz!

To be completely neutral, i agree with fridge here. Its a league. in a league all new participants start from the bottom. their dont just jump right in.

not to mention there are still some CPUs around, if everyone in CPU changed to BIA like everyone in relite changed to GG, then this substitution can occur.

However....

BIA≠CPU

So, this substitution cannot happen.

ta-da

PS: but i realize my inferiority and lack of wisdom compared to jay, so he obviously should make the final call. just giving my humble opion.