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United States Big: 2/3/2012 14:27:37

Gunz 
Level 45
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I've taken over management of the United States Big map. I know of few areas to clean up but am looking for other suggestions. If you know of a messed up link, bonus problem, or have any other comment; now's the time to let me know.
United States Big: 2/3/2012 14:34:14


farragut 
Level 58
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There appears to be a permanent **wasteland** in a small area between Virginia & Maryland. Can you see if you can fix that? :-)
United States Big: 2/3/2012 14:35:49

Qi 
Level 55
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10 major cities as 1 bonuses would be cool. last time i checked, us had a navy. adding the sea would be nice. rocky mountains? mississippi river? adding geographical features would make it more realistic and strategic
United States Big: 2/3/2012 14:41:20

algy
Level 46
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Although in most of the states (where there are multiple bonuses) the sum of bonuses is equal to the total number of territories in Ohio it is 78 vs 88.
United States Big: 2/3/2012 15:37:54


steamedhams
Level 50
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Chautauqua County, NY, and Warren County, PA, are completely missing. Also, there are 21 counties named "Unnamed".
United States Big: 2/3/2012 17:24:47

Typhoon 
Level 27
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Virginia is currently almost impossible to take due to the influx of tiny cities throughout it. They can't fit even single digit armies and make it a very, very confusing state to try and conquer.
United States Big: 2/3/2012 19:17:38

Segrain
Level 21
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**Green Lake** territory in **Wisconsin** belongs to **Southern Wyoming** instead of **Southern Wisconsin**.
United States Big: 2/3/2012 19:31:51


Matma Rex 
Level 12
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Yes, +1 about Virginia. If you wish to make this map better, kill the cities in it. First, they are difficult to take; second, if you actually manage it, you get enormous bonus for the entire state.

Also, Southern Wyoming bonus includes a sigle territory from... Wisconsin. (Select it and see.)
United States Big: 2/3/2012 22:16:11


x 
Level 58
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alaska and hawaii are missing
United States Big: 2/3/2012 22:17:07


x 
Level 58
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also, missouri is not and has never been a state
United States Big: 2/3/2012 22:18:02


x 
Level 58
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"alabama" should be "alabamy"
United States Big: 2/3/2012 23:47:48


NoZone 
Level 6
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+1 about Virginia. What a mess. Should lose all of those cities, cut the number of territories in half or something. I always stay away from there because of it.
United States Big: 2/3/2012 23:52:10


NoZone 
Level 6
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Off topic (sort of), I have always thought a Congressional districts map would be a good middle ground map between whole states versus all the counties. Depending on if you leave out AK and HI it would be on the scale of 500ish territories. Also would make for some crazy territory borders in those states where jerrymandering has gone out of control. Could actually be a series of maps from every ten years as districts are redrawn after the census/lawsuits.

It would put a US map on the scale of the Asia map which many folks like.

IF I had the time or skills, I would give it a try, but alas...
United States Big: 2/4/2012 01:33:21


Issander
Level 55
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http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/1b/US_Congressional_Districts_color.svg

If you were drawing territories from that map, then I say you'd be finished in one, maybe two days (working from dawn to dusk).
I may think about doing it after I'll finish big map that's being made now :)
United States Big: 2/4/2012 02:11:36

(Lost)SGV_STH
Level 23
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Gunz - Thank you for cleaning up this map. I cannot remember all of the issues I have faced. I will add on to what Segrain said about the Green Lake territory in Wisconsin and ask if it could be one of the first things to be fixed if possible. I believe that some territories in the Southeast had the issue of a missing connection or two and would guess that they might be in Georgia and Kentucky, but I might be incorrect. In any case, thanks again for doing this. :)

---

Issander - That does look like a good map, but it seems to soon be outdated. I counted Michigan's Districts at 15 from that map. However, Michigan has lost one district due to a decrease in the population of people living in Michigan in the 2010 census. I believe this is the current plan for how it will be redivided in Michigan, though it might be changed due to challenges due to possible gerrymandering:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/rf/image_606w/WashingtonPost/Content/Blogs/the-fix/StandingArt/MichiganProposed.jpg?uuid=YKdQypuCEeCxG385yZuJEA

While that map could still be used, its name might need to reflect that in some way if possible. I thought I would mention it in case someone does try it.
United States Big: 2/4/2012 02:42:36


NoZone 
Level 6
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After looking at the district maps I am less thrilled with the idea. Mostly it is an issue of different territories of radically different scales on the same map. Each district is approximately the same population, so they are teeny tiny in populated areas and huge in rural areas. There would have to be a lot of zooming in and out to really play it well. Bit of an aesthetic/playability negative. Labeling could be a huge issue too. Might work as a way to draw superbonuses on a state level map.

Won't know till someone makes it I suppose.
United States Big: 2/4/2012 07:43:32


Perrin3088 
Level 44
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Personally, I think that it would be more appropiate to be fixing the map, as opposed to entirely changing it to a new layout.. that should be in a seperate slot..

that being said +1 to virginia.. not because it is difficult to take, but because it is done in an *entirely different format* then the rest of the map. It should all have cities, or no cities at all

The addition of geographic functions would give it a nice balance throughout, rather then just being a huge glob of territories.
Sea links Imho, would change the map too much beyond what it was originally created for; although, duplicating the SVG and then making a more complete US Big map, including Alaska and Hawaii, with sea links throughout, or even re-making the idea with a new design with sea links I would highly encourage..



Gui, the US's possibility of a navy is irrelevant to the creation of maps.. If I play the europe map.. I could play it duplicating 2011, or I could play it duplicating 1121.. the addition of too many sea links limits the possibilities that the map could realisticly take into effect.. and you must keep in mind the time frames.. adding sea links would require many sea links to keep time-frames in mind.. consider how long it would take a M1 division to go through a state, clearing out any resistance inhabitants, then compare it to how long it would take a BB group to head through a certain section of water ensuring that there wasn't any resitance to be removed, and/or removing it.
United States Big: 2/4/2012 08:23:16


[中国阳朔]TexasJohn 
Level 35
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Perrin, not sure, but I don't think that VA is different, per se. Aren't the "cities" in that bonus technically "independent regions", ie not affiliated with any county? Although when playing that map I never ever consider taking VA, not efficient and god dang annoying.
United States Big: 2/4/2012 08:42:17


Perrin3088 
Level 44
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but each state throughout the map is seperated by county, and those counties are seperated into bonuses, to make each a relevant size and generally a solid shape. The larger ones are reduced slightly to make a super-bonus relevant for each state. the cities bonus follows neither of those rules, and make VA completely different then the rest of the map because of it..

Imho, it seems like the creator was thinking about adding in cities throughou, made it in VA, was testing it out, and then went Awol, leaving us with what we currently see..
as I stated before.. imho, it should be all states with cities, or none..
United States Big: 2/4/2012 13:36:11


steamedhams
Level 50
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Perrin, TXJohn's right. Virginia's 39 independent cities are county-equivalents. The United States has 3,143 counties and "county-equivalents". Alaska has 29 (18 boroughs and 11 census areas), Hawaii has 5, and the lower 48 has 3,109. The US Big WL map has 3,107 territories because it is inexplicably missing 2 counties in NY and PA along Lake Erie (Chautauqua, NY, and Warren, PA).

If you want to eliminate the 42 independent cities, I certainly understand, their small size does make them quite annoying (though no more annoying than New York's boroughs, or some of the small consolidated city-counties like Broomfield, CO, or San Francisco, CA). But I don't understand why you think the creator began adding cities then quit, since all 42 independent cities in the US are included (39 in VA, the other 3 being St Louis, MO, Baltimore, MD, and Carson City, NV).

See [this US County SVG map](http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/dc/USA_Counties.svg) or read about [county-equivalents](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/County_(United_States)).
United States Big: 2/4/2012 17:59:04

RvW 
Level 46
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Last week or so I sent some feedback; I'll assume that got lost and repost it:

---

Connections which I think should be added:

- Knott <--> Magoffin (Eastern Kentucky)
- Burke <--> Screven (Eastern Georgia)
- Bertie <--> Chowan (North-eastern North Carolina, see also next block)
- King and Queen <--> James City (Eastern Virginia)
- Philips <--> Tunica (Arkansas/Mississippi border)

Connections which I think shouldn't exist:
- Campbell <--> Niobrara (North-eastern Wyoming)
- Warren <--> Muhlenberg (South-western Kentucky)
- Burleigh <--> Wells (Central North Dakota)
- Grant <--> McPherson (Western Nebraska)
- Darke <--> Auglaize (Western Ohio)
- Bertie <--> Perquimans (North-eastern North Carolina, see also previous block)

In East Maryland, there are two territories (Dorchester and Somerset) which both have half an island belonging to them. Shouldn't that mean they'd be able to attack each other?

Unnamed territories:
Northwestern North Dakota ("top row, second from left")
(There are more, but I don't know of an easy way to locate them all.)

---

Also, I'd like to share two more thoughts:

- This map is clearly supposed to be an as-accurate-as-possible representation of the USA counties. For that reason, I think the "Independent Cities" bonus should stay. Sure, it sucks terribly bad, but that's what you get for mirroring a real-life situation. So, I'm all in favour of fixing actual errors (both like those mentioned in other posts (two missing territories, territories belonging to the wrong bonus, etc.) and the, possible, errors mentioned at the top of this post), but I would like to urge you not to make drastic changes to this map (removing the independent cities, adding water-links, drawing rivers, etc.) that change its purpose / violate its design philosophy.
- That being said, there's no reason why you couldn't "fork" this into two maps. First, fix issues (naming unnamed territories, adding missing territories, etc.) and upload an updated USA Big. Then, make a copy of the SVG and change it to your heart's contend (kill the independent cities, group (tiny) counties into small clusters, add Alaska and Hawaii, whatever). But don't overwrite USA Big, instead, upload it as "USA Big (optimized for WL playability)" (obviously, that's just a working title and could use a little work ;) ). I'm quite sure there'd be a lot of people who'd like another huge map!

This is just my two cents of course; you are now the maintainer, so ultimately, it's your decision. Do keep in mind though:

- you're essentially renovating a major landmark, so "tread lightly"
- "with great power comes great responsibility" :p
United States Big: 2/4/2012 19:00:23


Matma Rex 
Level 12
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A little offtopic, but...

@Issander
> http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/1b/US_Congressional_Districts_color.svg
<
> If you were drawing territories from that map, then I say you'd be finished in one, maybe two days (working from dawn to dusk).
> I may think about doing it after I'll finish big map that's being made now :)

You do realize you could probably just take that SVG, clean un, add Territory_ ids, bonus links, and have the vision ready? No need to re-draw it.

------------

@RvW

> Unnamed territories:
> (There are more, but I don't know of an easy way to locate them all.)

The [http://wiki.warlight.net/index.php/Query_game_API](query game API) could be used for that, if only you can point me to a tourney played on this map.
United States Big: 2/4/2012 20:17:54

RvW 
Level 46
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I've thought about (ab)using the API, but would that help? Sure, you can easily tell *if* there's any unnamed territories left, but for the unnamed territories, all you know is (probably meaningless) territory IDs...

However, I just thought of something which will actually work! :) (And not just for this map, it works on every map.) Just start a new game on USA Big and then:

- Click "Settings" in the left sidebar
- Click "Bonuses and Territories"
- Enter "Unnamed" in the search box ;)
- Click "Search"
- Starting at the top of the list, for every territory found:
- Click "Select"
- Scroll to the bottom of the territory info window, there you'll see which bonus it's in (click it to highlight the entire bonus, which is *much* more visible than a single territory being highlighted)
- Zoom in on that part of the map
- Click "Select" (for the territory) again, you should now be able to see where it is!
United States Big: 2/4/2012 21:03:04

RvW 
Level 46
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Image of USA Big with all 21 unnamed territories highlighted. (Ignore the orange one in Southern California; WL won't let me load the map unless I have a territory.)

![](http://i41.tinypic.com/35b9p5f.png)

Just knowing which territories are currently unnamed is of limited use; it would be much better to also know what they should be named. Unfortunately, I feel I've been helpful enough for one day (or: I don't want to take other people's chance to be helpful too away from them :p ), so that'll have to wait a bit.
United States Big: 2/5/2012 01:08:31


steamedhams
Level 50
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Bonner County, ID
Burke County, ND
Tripp County, SD
Bon Homme County, SD
Jewell County, KS
Pottawatomie County, KS
Wabaunsee County, KS
Pratt County, KS
Okmulgie County, OK
McIntosh County, OK
Dona Ana County, NM
Hunt County, TX
Caldwell County, TX
San Jacinto County, TX
Orange County, TX
Goodhue County, MN
Menard County, IL
Geauga County, OH
Walton County, GA
Taliaferro County, GA
Richmond County, GA
United States Big: 2/5/2012 06:34:40


Perrin3088 
Level 44
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RvW, why not just make a custom scenario where you own the unnamed territs?
United States Big: 2/5/2012 06:39:46


Perrin3088 
Level 44
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steamedhams, I stand corrected
United States Big: 2/5/2012 08:58:32

RvW 
Level 46
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@Perrin:
Because I didn't think of that, ouch. :(
Well, at least I had the first half of the brilliant idea... Next time I'll check with you for the second half of the brilliant idea before wasting a lot of time; you're right, a custom scenario would've been far easier (both for me and Gunz).

Oh, I forgot to mention in my previous post, the captcha tinypic.com gave me was "politically correct". :)
United States Big: 2/6/2012 04:29:29

RvW 
Level 46
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@steamedhams:
Cool work man, thank you very much for beating me to it! :D
United States Big: 2/6/2012 14:21:06

Gunz 
Level 45
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Thanks for all the comments; I've got plenty to keep me busy for a while. Thanks especially to RvW and steamedhams for the work on the unnamed counties. That will save me time.

Virginia: my goal isn't to change the map but to fix mistakes. The only change for VA is adding a connection for the Chesapeake Bay Bridge-Tunnel: eastern shore to the mainland.
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