Thomas this is the off-topic forum but...... is that related in anyway?

http://www.gifsforum.com/images/meme/trolling%20troll%20science%20and%20troll%20dad/grand/1492_bQB5z4Jv.jpg

Trying to wrap my head around it...

economy was never my strong skill.

Hello

Land of the free people, keep telling yourself that :P The government is less transparent than it's ever been in its history. Citizens enjoy fewer rights every year and the lobbyists run the legislative branch of the government. American's refuse to raise tax on the middle and upper class, but don't mind letting the poor jump through hoops just to collect food stamps.

And I can see why you'd use that case as an example. Who wants to go to school when you can stay home all day and...dunno, be ignorant? Education is a right in Germany and parent's neglecting their children's right to an education is criminal. Also, imprisonment is kind of harsh. I'm inclined to say he was charged, if I'm mistaken provide a link showing otherwise, please.

Usually the reason for homeschooling isn't like that: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MzLwKPSWcI4

I believe with homeschooling in Germany it strongly depends on the senior schooling authority in your district. If they want to go after you they can give you a really hard time. Here is a link where someone faced imprisonment: http://www.sueddeutsche.de/bildung/urteil-des-bundesverfassungsgerichts-haftstrafen-fuer-schulverweigerer-eltern-sind-rechtens-1.2210364. I don't have first hand experience but do have second hand experience with the problems parents face not sending their children to school. There is a very realistic fear that the police shows up and drives your children to school and a more abstract fear that the state completely takes away your children.

The German government is very clear in stating that homeschooling is not acceptable. While it may be considered acceptable (although uncommon) in the US, it's not something the German government will tolerate, because a child has a right and role in education and integration within the society.

Every country weighs freedom differently, but there's always a price paid (it's theorized under the Social Contract: http://www.academia.edu/3138759/Social_Contract_Theory_by_Hobbes_Locke_and_Rousseau). There is no society in which you can literally do whatever you want, some freedoms will need to be laid aside for the greater good. That being said, the German government lays importance on the integration and education of children.

It should be noted that German schools don't suffer the level of mobbing and violence that American schools do, so homeschooling is only vigilantly pursued by strict religious and/or alternative lifestyle types.

I was a child who didn't go to school by choice, my mum ended up going to court over it. They threw it out because i was already over 16 when the system finally took us to court. That's england though, not germany.

On-topic(ish):

I don't beleive that America is innocent, but i'm very 50/50 on them being the worst in the world. At least they have people trying to fight for the good side. Some countrys don't even have that.

Die Allgemeinheit habe ein berechtigtes Interesse daran, religiös oder weltanschaulich motivierten Parallelgesellschaften entgegen zu wirken, argumentierte das Bundesverfassungsgericht.

Sounds very reasonable to me. If you are born into any kind of fundamentalist family, like a religous sect or ultrareligous practioners for that matter, or some kind of racist hate group, you have no chance but to be indoctrinated.
Despite all criticsm concerning public schools, justified or not, the act of homeschooling can prevent innocent children from getting into touch with a pluralistic society.
Whether or not homeschooling should be allowed if certain conditions are met that prevent children to be isolated and totally dependend on their parents or legal overloads is a totally different matter, i wouldn't want to stand against homeschooling per se.

The state does have a right to prevent physical abuse of children by their parents, why shouldnt it be allowed to prevent mental abuse as well?

I don't beleive that America is innocent, but i'm very 50/50 on them being the worst in the world. At least they have people trying to fight for the good side. Some countrys don't even have that.

Thats ridiculous, every country has them.

What about Boratistan?

because a child has a right and role in education and integration within the society.


Homeschooler children are usually more inelegant then the masses. Also don't be stereotypical homeschooler children are integrated into society as well.

I have no idea what you tried to say there, but homeschooled children are not actually better integrated:

http://www.middleschool.net/negative-homeschooling.htm

http://www.educationcorner.com/benefits-disadvantages-of-homeschooling.html

While homeschooled children spend a lot more time with their parents and the family, the amount of additional effort you have to go through to compensate for what public schools provide much more efficiently, outweigh most of the benefits. This is especially true when you consider that the ones who tend to pursue this most adamantly are the ones that are already "social deviants".

Germany takes parallel societies serious, since their most recent dictator was raised up out of a similar grass roots movement.

The easiest way to counter extremism in society is to make sure that every individual has a place where they fit in. When they do, they're much less likely to form their own little tea party, which is ironically something that is springing up all over the US atm.

Edited 3/21/2015 16:01:41

"much less likely to form their own little tea party" or Pegida............. oh wait Germany has that

Wanna compare the number of radical, extremist and hate-mongering groups springing up in Germany and the US? Even if you take population and economic differences into consideration, Germany is doing remarkably better, which I think you knew before you posted your comment.

You know nothing Tupac Snow! Typical Europe bashing.

Damn Europens and their "unions" it's pernuced "onyun" (this is a joke)

Hello

Germany takes parallel societies serious, since their most recent dictator was raised up out of a similar grass roots movement.
An interesting example. In fact it's an important part of totalitarian governments that they want to take the children from their parents so they have the power to inject their own values into them. It's no coincidence that the compulsory school attendance was firstly introduced in Germany by the Nazi Party 1938. It's the same today just that the values have changed. Voting this transvestite guy in the ESC was no sign of tolerance but in fact he represents exactly the values that the German mainstream socciety stands for. It's the schools job to inject those values into the thinking of the kids. I went through pretty much all parts of the German school system. Later on school was mainly for teaching me stuff but the years 1-10 were just pure indoctrination. The teachers even organised some kissing and massaging games between boys and girls and a game where you had to use your mouth to take a fruit out of someone else's mouth. I'm not even talking about the evolution courses where they basically teach you that the bible is a lie just to teach you later in your Christian education classes some values that perfectly fit into the German mainstream society but are all but Christian.

Even the most fascist of all societies tolerate you if you are mainstream. In Germany being an American bashing leftist is just another part of the accepted mainstream, maybe if you take yourself to serious you might believe that the NSA is watching you but that's it.

It seems like chilrens rights is the new gateway for the fascist German mainstream society to suppress those who aren't mainstream. For example a couple of years ago the mainstream seriously discussed on eliminating Judaism from Germany 'again': http://www.nytimes.com/2012/09/20/world/europe/circumcision-debate-in-europe-reflects-deeper-tensions.html?_r=0

I have no idea what you tried to say there, but homeschooled children are not actually better integrated:

Didn't say they were better but they could be it's dependant on the individual.


While homeschooled children spend a lot more time with their parents and the family, the amount of additional effort you have to go through to compensate for what public schools provide much more efficiently, outweigh most of the benefits. This is especially true when you consider that the ones who tend to pursue this most adamantly are the ones that are already "social deviants".


Homeschooling is more flexible, usually more inelegant, more time to fix problems in something your failing in, more time to learn something your interested in, can pee and crap when you want, eat when you want and eat good food not crap, sporting is easy to get into, there a crap ton home school groups where I live so I'm positive they socialize with each other. They also do more community service then public school.

But not everybody should do it major thing you need

Money.

Patience.



The easiest way to counter extremism in society is to make sure that every individual has a place where they fit in. When they do, they're much less likely to form their own little tea party, which is ironically something that is springing up all over the US atm.

That's because you live in a country that make all other ideologies Ileagle.

It's no coincidence that the compulsory school attendance was firstly introduced in Germany by the Nazi Party 1938.

And the French under Napoleon Bonaparte, the Japanese during the Meiji Restoration, the Chinese after the establishment of the CCP and the US after WWI and another "revival" after WWII. Your comparison here is moot.

Later on school was mainly for teaching me stuff but the years 1-10 were just pure indoctrination.

Hmm, my experience was quite different, but I went to one of the top schools in Berlin, so I can't speak for everyone. Yes, school is in part indoctrination and I myself don't appreciate the anti-religious stance that public education takes. However, I grew up in a household where questioning the status-quo was our bread and butter.

I can say that my school life was significantly better in Germany than it was in the US.

Even the most fascist of all societies tolerate you if you are mainstream. In Germany being an American bashing leftist is just another part of the accepted mainstream, maybe if you take yourself to serious you might believe that the NSA is watching you but that's it.

Mainstream Germany is not leftist. Merkel is not socialist, even though she likes to look like one in the media. I also don't like being thrown in with the "American bashing leftists" as I tend to bash on a wide-scale. You'll note that I made a rather snarky remark about the Chinese in this thread.

It seems like chilrens rights is the new gateway for the fascist German mainstream society to suppress those who aren't mainstream. For example a couple of years ago the mainstream seriously discussed on eliminating Judaism from Germany 'again'

The debate of circumcision is a valid one. If you want to strip something from your child's body before (in this case he) has a chance to decided whether he wants to part with it, it's a violation of the child's rights, unless it's a threat to the child's health of course. Strange that Muslims aren't making such a big fuss about it as the Jewish community is, since they have the same practice. It's the Jewish community crying Nazi, because the German government did something they don't approve of, which is just another example of Zionism to me. If a boy wants to part with his foreskin, he can always make the decision himself when he's 16.

But not everybody should do it major thing you need

Money.

Patience.

If you had read the links I provided, that was clearly stated in one of the articles.

That's because you live in a country that make all other ideologies Ileagle.

Please back this up with at least an example so I can form a decent rebuttal.